FIRST ON CNN: Panetta to recommend pay cut for military
By Barbara Starr
Just days before he leaves office, Defense Secretary Leon Panetta is recommending military pay be limited, effectively decreasing troop salaries next year.
Panetta will recommend to Congress that military salaries be limited to a 1% increase in 2014. The Pentagon has calculated that the Labor Department's 2014 Employment Cost Index is expected to be above 1% but wants to still cut back on pay because of "budget uncertainties," a department official told CNN. In 2013, a 1.7% increase was approved, based on the index, which has been the basis for military pay for the last several years.
Three Pentagon officials have confirmed details of the plan to CNN. The Joint Chiefs of Staff have also agreed to Panetta's proposed pay plan. Final approval for the pay would come from Congress in the form of the 2014 budget.
The recommendation is tied to the Defense Department's 2014 budget recommendation, which was expected to be sent to Congress this month, one of the officials said. But the officials acknowledge it is going to be seen as an effort to push Congress to stop the automatic budget cuts that could go into effect if no deal is reached on spending reductions.
ALSO: Panetta warns spending cuts will degrade military readiness
The decision comes as the secretary is stepping up the rhetoric about dire cuts at the Pentagon if sequestration goes into effect. President Obama in 2012 walled off military pay from cuts, so if this current pay plan goes into effect, it's widely seen as "cutting our pay," one military officer familiar with the plan told CNN. "It's a smart move, it puts it in Congress' hands," he said.
Panetta, in one of his last official speeches as secretary of defense, told an audience at Georgetown University on Wednesday that the Pentagon faced "the most serious readiness crisis in over a decade."
The defense secretary outlined a series of possible cuts should the Pentagon be forced to find half a trillion dollars more in savings. He warned that 800,000 civilian workers could furloughed for 22 days and that the Army would need to cut back on training and maintenance, putting two-thirds of combat teams at "reduced readiness levels." Pacific naval operations could be cut by as much a third, and Air Force flying hours and weapons maintenance could be cut.
CNN has also learned that this week, the Navy is expected to announce it does not have the money to pay for refueling and maintenance of the aircraft carrier Abraham Lincoln. That will essentially mean the Navy is short a carrier and overseas deployments will be cut.
"No good options exist," Panetta said.
@natlsecuritycnn on Twitter
How about lets not. Why don't your politicians skip a pay raise and let the Soldiers have it.
how but these idiots cut THEIR OWN PAY instead of those that do more work than these people could do in a life time. They are already severely underpaid, they make less than minimum wage.
Thats the bigeest mistake they could ever make. Those folks are already so underpaid.
The negative comments about a 1% pay raise for the military is BS. The military have underpaid forever; instead of a pay cut, or ceiling on any COLA, there should be a massive reduction in military spending, in the form of the hundreds of millions spent on planes, ships etc, not to mention the troops stationed in other countries. A MASSIVE pay raise across the board for military is what's needed! It is a disgrace that many military families have to use food stamps to make ends meet; and no, i'm not in the military or have any family members in the military, either. Maybe Mr Panetta and his ilk could take a massive pay cut to allow the military to be paid for what they do for us every day.
We are military and I know of only 2 families on food stamps and that's their own dang fault. One came in with 3 kids because he was unemployable anywhere else and his wife doesn't want to work, he's an E1. The other now has FIVE children as an E2 (3 with disabilities because the doctor told them no more kids after the third one was born disabled and they decided to have more kids anyway). Guy is overweight and can't pass his PT test so they are getting kicked out...and have readily admitted they won't be able to survive as civilians. We've been in 12 years now and most military are not paid peanuts based on their experience. Just like welfare if you are in the military and on foodstamps it's your OWN fault for not practicing family planning
Your right on but sadly enough obama has shown everyone else that will ever want to run for office that food stamps and koolaid will do the trick PLUS any minority that they can entice........Its not whats good for America, its all about getting the votes...We are done ...Our government is bleeding us dry. Wanting more from us and giving us less..
Megan, you sound like an officer's wife, or at least like someone I wouldn't want living next to me in civilian life. I know a couple who were both military. They had a child with cystic fibrosis after they were married. They weren't making a lot of money and had to spend some of their "excessive" pay on medical care for the child since CHAMPUS didn't cover all the expenses. Not everyone in the military has the luxury of having everything they need.
actually I am prior enlisted (6 years) adn my husband is a prior service officer. The fact of the matter is that no medical insurance is going to cover 100% of everything, and it's sad about their daughter but I am sure they were paying MUCH less for her treatment then if they were on pretty much any other insurance plan. I never said they were excessively paid, I said they were paid sufficiently when you add in BAH, BAS, Base Pay, Enlisted Bonus, no premiums for Tricare, no copays for medications in a MTF for their education and experience level. When I was an E2 I had NO problems paying all my bills. Yea I didn't have the nicest stuff but I made decent money. We didn't opt for children until we were able to without it breaking the bank and to this day have NO problems paying our bills. The problem with these people claiming food stamps for the most part is that most of them are thinking with the wrong head. AND you have to remember that if non taxable pays and base housing perks were included in those benefit eligibility calculations the bulk of the ones that get them would not be eligible for them.
TWO families on food stamps are TWO TOO MANY!
MEGAN:
That sentence says it all, “Actually I am prior enlisted (6 years) and my husband is a prior service officer.” Prior service officer. I’m pretty sure that’s the same thing as an officer. My husband is enlisted and I have friends who are married to officers. I don’t know if you know this but an officers life and pay are vastly different from the enlisted they are in charge of. Not only are officers paid better from day 1, which I agree with as they have college degrees, but they are given better housing or higher allowances to live off base, and some can make their own schedules (coming and going as they please). I don’t know many officer spouses that work, though some do, it seems like most of them volunteer their time because they don’t need the additional income. In contrast, I know many enlisted spouses who work or want to work as they need the additional income for their families to survive month to month. I’ve lived in a military one bedroom studio, base housing, with an uncovered parking lot and a walk to the laundry facility. Nothings perfect and we can’t all be millionaires, but let’s just say that some have had it easier than others.
I’m also not sure what you mean about an enlisted bonus or the MTF for education and experience level. Enlisted are not paid based on education, they are paid based on rank and years of service. Some of those who re-enlist are eligible for re-enlistment bonuses, but that is to both keep more experienced service members and make up for the pay differential with the civilian sector.
Also, BAS is taxable. It’s a minimal payment that does not cover household food and misc. expenses like toilet paper or Ziploc bags for even a family of 2. Plus it is taken away when the service member is in the field or deployed as it is considered money to feed the service member, not their families.
Whether you want to acknowledge it or not, there are many, both in the military and civilian who qualify for food stamps and WIC. The fact is there are many service members, rank E-1 to E-4, who have only one child and qualify for assistance. One reason can be because they are one income family. Not all have the ability to have two incomes and afford childcare; it’s not always financially feasible. One of my friend’s spouses was Navy, E-3, they had one child and she worked and they still qualified for financial assistance.
I don’t know what they taught you in health class but the only family planning that is 100% effective is abstinence, which usually doesn’t work out well between married folks. I know more than one person who was on birth control and found out they were pregnant. Not all family planning is perfect and sometimes people make bad decisions.
And you are probably right about them paying less for treatment than if they were in the civilian sector. The difference being in the civilian sector you get to choose your treatment facility, doctor, and what coverage’s you want. I have two choices, Tricare Standard or Tricare Prime. Standard has no copays at military facilities or prescriptions, though it is not possible to get anything other than generic medications. If you live a certain distance to the hospital then you have to go there. If you’re out of range you can usually pick a provider that accepts it and pay no copays. It does cost to get prescriptions anywhere but military pharmacies, unless you’re active duty. Prime on the other hand has copays for every visit and prescription, like civilian health care, and they pay more to see specialists and most things are covered at 80% after you meet the annual premium. Prime also requires you to stay on it for a year, minimum, when switching from Standard.
I guess the point I’m making is that not everything is black and white. There are benefits to being in the military. There are definite draw backs, like not being able to see a child born, birthday, or holiday. Yes deployments suck and some are longer than a year. I love that my husband is a Marine and I’m proud of the sacrifice he’s are making for our family and for this country. Though that sacrifice doesn’t just stop at him, I have been short changed his presence on many occasions.
Elections have consequences. Vote for Dems. They care for military families. /sarcasm
Many military families are already barely making it, and this will make things worse.
Your political biased sunglasses were still on when you read this... Obama didn't make this recommendation, Panetta did.. And if you watched his LIVE speech this morning, he said you must put everything on the table to reduce the deficit....
Who do you think Panetta speaks for? When he speaks, it's speaking for Pres Obama regarding the President's decisions on military matters.
Ha! My neighbor in the military makes more money in housing allowance than my whole salary.
Then you should find something better than working at mcdonalds.
You must have a really bad jog b/c the BAH is around $1400., depending on where you live. That is what it is for us. So please don't over exaggerate what you don't really know.
What a misleading headline! What the headline should say is that Panetta is reducing the annual raise for military members.
I said the same. Get ready for a bunch of comments on about how a decrease in an annual increase effectively reduces take home pay due to taxes and inflation.
Doesn't change the fact that the headline is misleading.
When you read it, I bet you didn't think about taxes or inflation or annual increases, you thought about base pay... most people won't.
Fact is, military pay is tied to cost of living index. Diverging from that historical linkage, in a downward trend, is a pay cut. Period. Let's not start making apologies ahead of time.
it's not a cut, per-say, it's basically lowering the annual raise to the point where it won't keep up with inflation, so effectively a PAY CUT.
Hey Wakeup, Amerika, did you use your welfare check to buy a computer? At least your not buying drugs!
NO NEED TO BUY DRUGS, NO-SIREE! THE STATE HAS BEEN CRAMMING PSYCHO-TROPIC MEDS DOWN MY THROAT SINCE I WAS 5 YEARS OLD.
.......We have bases in...120 separate countries around the world..............WHY?...........Close some of these bases, in..........Germany, Italy, UK, because WW2 has been over for oh, about 4 MILLION YEARS........Then PAY OUR BOYS AND WOMEN IN THE SERVICE..
Actually, many bases HAVE been closed in Germany and I project more will be closed in the next couple decades. We will not likely get rid of Ramstein Air Base or Grafenwoehr/Hohenfels though. Those are all too important.
A 1% pay raise is more of a raise than many Americans have received the last few years combined. Welcome to the new economy! And don't give me this "hero" BS, as many in the military only joined because they couldn't find jobs here. In the military they preach of being part of a team, well enjoy teaming with the civilians who also face hardships in getting paid.
Inderstand the private sector impact, I am down 50%, but lets make any ellected official that can't create and live within a budget forfeit thier entire salary, Its laughable how many congressman that could not save a nickel thier entire life in personal savings are miliionaires after 10 years in office.
Live up to your "hero" moniker and be like the working class heroes who have to get up to jobs they hate every day just to make ends meat, rarely getting raises (usually pay cuts), and unlike the servicemen don't get the daily adulation of being called "heroes."
It tells me a lot about all the "sacrifice" and "dedication" of people serving when they whine about only getting a small raise. Aren't you the same people who say you're "just doing your duty?" Your duty now is to serve with less coin in your pocket, which to those who have been in war zones shouldn't be a big deal at all.
The military protects your freedom to make stupid comments like this. As a vet, if you don't like it, then get the F out and go live in another country where you are REQUIRED to serve and pay is set as a standard...
Phillip, you are a disgrace to America, go live somewhere else. The economy is the way it is because of people like you period.
It kills me when people complain about how "great" life is for servicemembers, how overpaid they are, their benefits are too good, etc.
If it's such a great deal, why the hell didn't you join?
they should just start taxing BAQ and comrats. awaits for all the unamerican comments. DOnt like it move to somolia, hear the militia pays really well, or become a pirate.
DevilDawg, I was in Iraq and Afghanistan while the whole housing bubble grew. How did I help ruin the economy? Granted I had to go white collar because my knees and shoulder don't function as well after getting shot, but yeah, you people are right. I know nothing about military life and need to leave a country I damn near died for so that I can approve of their military pay policies.
Are you all listening to yourselves? Everyone has to sacrifice in bad times, including the servicemen!
I agree with you, Phillip, and all these pseudo "patriots" can go flog themselves. Everyone has to share in the financial problems that have hit this country, and that includes the "hero's" in the military, many many MANY of which have never served one day in combat.
You've obviously never served Phillip or they wouldn't take you......You're not looking at the fact that their base pay is lower across the board in comparable civ positions, so a 1.7 or even a 1% raise is nothing... Inflation is higher than that.. Chump, go troll somewhere else..
First off KJ, yes I have 2002-2006, and I also got to enjoy the fun of getting shot at en route to doing my job many mornings. That's not relevant here, but if it was I'd say I have my MBA from a top 10 university and could tell you your opinion isn't relevant because you don't know what I know. I'm in the civilian sector now and still do work on defense contracts. Anyways, in the civilian sector workers don't simply get a 1.74% raise plus compensation for new tax codes put in place by the government. Naturally people want to get paid more. Plenty of troops stateside will sit on their butts for an extra half hour playing games in order to make extra coin. There is waste everywhere in the military, including with the troops themselves.
I enjoyed serving with people who did it because it was the right thing to do. I didn't want people disgruntled about pay covering my butt while I'm getting shot at. I wanted people who were my patriotic brothers who would have served regardless of price.
Troll? Child please...
Philip,
Sit down, shut up and listen kid! The majority of the people in the military, like myself, know far more about bearing true faith and allegiance to our country than most of the civilian sheep out there. I for one am more than willing to take a pay cut for the good of my country. What bothers me is that punk-@ss jerks like you will never hold illegal aliens or those on welfare accountable let alone holding the biggest criminals of all, our Congress and President, accountable for the sad state of affairs that our country is currently in. Don't worry Phil, I am an active-duty Infantry Soldier, and I promise that I and those like me will defend you and those who lead our country in spite of the fact that you are not willing to do it yourselves. The majority of us in the military agree that we should not be getting pay raises while our country is suffering, but remember you are the ones who put these people in charge making these and other obviously stupid decisions. And hey, I'm sure that you probably think it makes perfect sense to cut our pay while Congress will more than likely vote to give themselves yet another pay raise. Considering what our country is going through I think we should all be feeling the pain...including you. Go preach to a different part of the population that actually needs to hear what you have to say.
I don't want you defending me. I was shot twice and had our vehicle blown away by a roadside bomb. I can cover myself boy... Lived it for 4 years and thank God I didn't have to serve with you.
"Many joined because they couldnt find a job"? I was just thinking that in all the years that I spent in uniform of all the people that met who couldnt get a job so figured what the heck....I've got nothing better to do for the next 8 years. Thanks for the completely ignorant depiction of the "many" people in the military Philip. A more accurate depiction is there are 2 types of military members. Those that love it and are doing it because of patriotism. And those that are doing to help pay for school or learn a skill. I may have misread your underlying message, but in case I didnt....show some respect for people that have tougher choices each day than do I get regular or decaf coffeee today.
No, he's right. Want to know where plenty of soldiers are when they return? In restaurant kitchens. If Applebees ever gets invaded, they'll be in good shape. There are plenty of soldiers who would be working minimum wage if they decided to remain a civilian. What about all the rapes in the military? Don't think those guys wouldn't be criminals in the real world? Put a headset on a guy in Taco Bell, he's a loser. Put a headset on a guy in Afghanistan fighting people in a 3rd world country, who were 8 years old when 9/11 happened, he's a hero.
It's obvious to me that Philip did'nt serve his country. The only thing that is BS Philip is that those that serve or have served have continued to protect the rights of people like you. The self serving, self licking icecream cone that you appear to be. Enjoy your freedom while you have it. Cut the military and you won't have the freedom that you don't deserve.
When I was on active duty I sure didn't get the chance to fight the terrorists in CNN chat rooms over news articles.
The best tasting ice cream cone I ever had was when I came to 2 days after being shot and realizing I'd get to finally go home to live a civilian life again. Coming that close to death you realize what is important in life, and my friend it isn't a pay raise...
Mark, I joined after the draft ended because jobs weren't available. I wanted to be career military. But after seeing pay raises that didn't cover cost of living, a commander that restricted his troops ability to excel beyond what he felt was appropriate, and two children, I left the military. I even had the chance to re-enlist two years later but couldn't see why I should cut my take home pay in half and deprive my family. I miss the military and often wonder what my life would have been like if things had been different. I may have been living paycheck to paycheck during that period in my life but I believe it made me a better person than some of the commenters on this site.
This is a long-shot, but is this Philip Padron, US Army??
Cutting our pay! Are you kidding me! We don't do this for the money we do this because we love our country and we are willing to defend it all enemies both foreign and domestic. How about you taking a pay cut Leon. You try to live on what we make, shop at the commissary, live on post in crappy housing, pay for day care and gas in your car. Oh I don't drive a fancy car, I drive what I can afford and try to save money for my next move and my life after the Army. I work 12 hour days and weekends Leon when is the last time you pulled a 24 hour shift? Just asking. When is the last time you lived through a sand storm, showerd with a liter bottle of water. I love my job, I love my country and most of all I love being a soldier. Maybe it's time for me to rethink my life choices get and out and live of welfare and in section 8 housing. Oh wait I'll even get food stamps which is far more than what I'm getting now. We have no problem giving WIC and food stamps to the illegals because the pop a kid out here in america. Don't say it dosen't happen the are in front of me at Wal-Mart. So when will you stop paying for everyone else and invest in your military and the way of life that your asking me to lay my life down for? Thanks Leon. Oh our Vets get the same pay raise and guess what some of those people have to live on just there retirement because of war wounds that you can't sse. Great more Vets on the streets. There is a trickle down effect to all your cuts.
I SMELL SELF-SERVING BULLSH!T.
Have you every served in any branch of service? My guess is no. There is nothing self serving about what I said. I think I hit a nerve. I choose this life and I will stay and retire. I'll take my pay cut but those have served before me and with me that could no longer do this deserve so much better than 1%. I'm sure disability or welfare check will see more than a 1 % raise. You need to wake up or maybe you need a vacation to one of those countries that we die in daily to appriciate what we do for self serving ass wagons like you. Oh I'm sure we paid for your meds since you were 5 also. So your disabilty running around with your goverment issue health care cards using health acre like it's free. Your the reason America is going broke.
AND YOU, KMA, ARE THE REASON AMERIKA IS STAYING STUPID.
Oh soldier stand down !! Enough of this I served my country BS. If you are really committed to serve this country, will do this for free ? You can't get a job anywhere else, you joined the military, gov't called you a hero to fight their war.....
Lots of civilians do not even get a raise...
So KMA spare us the BS !!
Look Jack Wagon I have a degree and I can get a job in any hospital in the US. There is a nursing shortage, again this is my choice. Just like it's your choice to stay at your do nothing going no where job. At least I get sandy vacations with no ocean view. Maybe you should join and see if you can feed your family of privates pay. So 1 % is nothing to a family in the sevice. Wlak a mile is a service men or womens shoes before you talk crap. Let me guess your to fat to join or to scared, you like if nice and safe. Well we are keeping you that way.
"...I stand ready to deploy, engage, and destroy the enemies of the United States of America in close combat,
I am the guardian of freedom and the American way of life...."
...and I will be no matter what congress decides to do.
Why do we punish our troops who serve in our Armed Forces. I say we cut the pay of every welfare and disability recipient before we cut the pay of those that serve in our armed forces.
THE AMERICAN MILITARY IS THE BIGGEST WELFARE QUEEN ON THE ENTIRE PLANET. MOST OF OUR COMBAT TROOPS AREN'T "FIGHTING FOR US", AREN'T "FIGHTING FOR DEMOCRACY", AREN'T "FIGHTING FOR OUR WAY OF LIFE" – THEY'RE FIGHTING FOR A GREEN CARD. AND A PAYCHECK.
At least they are fighting instead of sitting around.
Hey Slick, What do you do for your country?
were bringing freedom to crappy little CoUNTrys.
You have got to be the biggest douchnozzle posting in response to this article...just amazes me at the stupidity of some people....
HEY, JOHN – EARNED A LIVING, PAID TAXES, NO CRIMINAL RECORD. THESE AREN'T ACCOMPLISHMENTS, THESE ARE THINGS ONE'S SUPPOSED TO DO. SERVE A VILE, FACIST ORGANIZATION THAT EXPORTS DEATH AND DESTRUCTION TO CIVILLIANS AROUND THE WORLD? NO THANKS.
I respect the fact that you have a job and pay taxes, however your comments on the our Military are insulting and misguided. Unless you walked in our shoes, serve your country, you simply do not understand. Because of us, you get the right to wake up every morning, a free man. The freedom that you have to spew moronic comments about the brave men and women in our military. As "brave" as you sounded, you would not last one week in my ARMY!!!
I am disgusted by this. I am in the US military and currently deployed. I get to see and hear what happens to the rest of my military brothers and sisters putting their lives on the line for a country. It is an ugly reality. And what are they getting blown up for? Why do we spend days, months, and even years away from our families for? For a country whose leaders don't believe we are worthy enough to get a decent raise to take care of the families that have to deal with the consequences of our jobs. We are cutting budget everywhere else, why can't they cut their own salary? Where are the priorities of these people??
Are you kidding me! Congress needs their pay cut plain and simple. They should also not be paid anything until they agree on how to fix the problem that they created. What has happed to "We the people" and "For the people". This is totally inexcusable.
I'm so glad to be leaving the Army this Friday (and officially out next month after terminal leave). We already got our lowest pay increase in nearly 30 years under Obama. Now they are going to do this? Time to utilize my GI Bill before the govt tries taking that away too.
I'm not sure I understand how a 1% increase amounts to a pay cut.
John, when the cost of living index goes up anything higher than that 1%, they are losing money. It's like when you get a $100 raise, yet your insurance and tax burden increase by $110. You're losing money. Is that fair? I don't think you would like that to happen to you year after year. That's what the military has been dealing with.
At least they didn't try to cut cost by not feeding them....Oh wait, yeah they did.
LADIES AND GENTLEMEN, MAY I PRESENT TO YOU THE WORLD'S BIGGEST WELFARE RECIPIENT.......
THE UNITED STATES MILITARY!
Really, pick up one of their shifts and then talk your smack. You have no idea how hard these men and women work to provide the freedom for you to run your mouth like that. Feel free not to post any further, you obviously do not know what you are talking about.
The only difference is our troops wake up and go to work for a paycheck.
TRUTH HURTS, HUH, BOYS?
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Not welfare recipients, they earn their money. so SHUT UP STUPID!
HOW CAN IT BE "THEIR" MONEY, WHEN IT'S YOUR TAXES? ISN'T THAT.....SOCIALISM?.....IT IS!
AAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!
truth don't hurt at all. in fact, i am proud to be one of the few "welfare recipents" that get up and work for my monthly pay, five to seven days per week.
-TheBigSarge
I HAVE TO ADMIT I ENVY A MAN WHO LOVES WHAT HE DOES FOR A LIVING. AND I APPRECIATE YOUR CANDOR.
Yes, it is "Their" money...military troops pay taxes too ya know...if you really think about it they contribute towards their own salary
Wake Up Amerika is probably pist off because he or she does not have the intelligence, physical endurance, and courage to get in the military. Welfare, really? I just retired after 28 years in the Army, my tax bill this year is about 16K, I also pay taxes on my military retirement. About 40 to 60 percent of my time in service was spent away from my family and never had a "9 to 5" job. Oh and I have lost the use of my legs and partial use of one hand defending this country. Welfare? I think not. Your tax dollars (if you have a job) spent on Military Service Members is money well spent.
YOU'VE NEVER SERVED! CUT THE BULLSH!T!
IT'S THOSE WHO HAVE THE WILL TO TELL THEIR GOVERNMENT, F–K YOU!.....I WILL NOT BE A PARTY TO MURDER, WHO HAVE MORE B@LLS THAN YOU AND THE REST OF YOUR BLOOD-THIRSTY, CHICKENKENHAWK ILK EVER WILL!!!
SUCK ON THAT, PAPER WARRIOR!!!!!
Yep, ignore the largest R&D budget in the world. As always, target the troops.
Leon Panetta, you like all of your predecessors are a complete jerk.
R&D is being cut 40%...that is large and will hit the economy.
That's great, hit it for another 10% and pay the troops.
I am a quite simple-minded person. However, I believe the Americans who work hard to protect fellow Americans should be paid more than "movie stars." I would much rather see the military receive more benefits and pay than buy a ticket to another trashy movie!!
We should pay troops on the front line a hell of a lot more. The ones that are not on the front line should get payed less than the ones on the frontline. They should have a risk percentage to calculate your pay. This should also apply to government officals.
we do. there is an allotment for Soldiers deployed to combat areas. plus, there is no income or state tax applied to the Soldier's salary. this also means that their tax burden is reduced to only the amount of base pay that they received while in the US or another non-combat area, such as Germany, italy, etc.
-TheBigSarge
rolldog, I agree that our military members should be paid more. However, just to be clear, they are already paid more for combat pay and hazard pay. As for being frontline or rear echelon, we all enlisted in our MOS knowing what that entailed. I for one picked airborne because I was young and stupid for one, but wanted to be in the fight. Thankfully having served in the Clinton era didnt require us to be deployed for combat. Regardless, slowing the increase of their raises is a slap in the face of those that are already underpaid.
theBigSarge, I am aware of the pay of troops at the current state of time. I am actually saying that the current pay scale is not proportionate to what it should be. The government officials should be the first to take the largest pay cut, because they are not in as much immediate danger as the troops are in the frontline. They is still dangers taking political office though as there is joining the military. However, the troops on the front line have a constant danger and should get paid more than already getting paid. I mean they don't get taxed etc...,but when they get hurt the benefits do not equal what they have to go through for the rest of there lives. I just saying we should pay something like 5 times the amount for guys on the front line (it could be better equipment or better support etc...) then the guys on the back line.
Funny how they vote themselves a raise but the hell with everyone else!!! Military already suffering due to allowing gays in and woman in combat, and now they want to cut there pay. This is all been Obama's plan to degrade this country and make us more like a third world country. If they would of not spent the money and want more money for the illegals educations, welfare etc. They would not need to raise taxes and cut military etc.
The military, like everything else in this country has massive waste. Need to cut some of it. Everyone else has to, why not them too?
YES! The military should cut programs that are wasteful to the American taxpayer....key word being programs! Cutting the troops pay who are sworn to defend our country is not cutting out waste it is taking money away from them that they depend on to support their families and pay their own bills. Sure the troops have made mistakes over the past ten years...the media is sure to cover that, but the good they have done far outweighs the bad make no argument about it.
I do believe that a tax raise across the board to the every American is fair but to target one minority such as the military is wrong considering how much they have done since 9/11.
We are not suffering because of our fellow Airmen, Soldiers, Sailors, Marines, and Coasties. But we ARE suffering fools like you, and the Congress people like you elect.
Thank you Jim; you were much more civil in your response to this ignorant barstool than I would have been.
Already suffering due to gays and women in combat roles? Really? I served with a half dozen gay soldiers in my company in Iraq and am heading to Afghanistan later this year with those same troops. Women make up nearly 40% of my support battalion and have always served honorably. With the majority of Americans unfit to serve, what else are you proposing?
The solution is not a paycut. If people have less money, they buy less. If they buy less then companies do not need that many man hours, hence job cuts. The military pay cuts are not going to solve anything. It just make some fell comfortable that they are saving the taxpayers on military cuts, but forget to tell you how many jobs those cuts will effect. It is a complicated economy, it you cut here you gain there (correlations).
You got it wrong Leon. While you and other members of this administration collect your salaries, pensions and other benefits, your suggestion to cut the military is quite hypocritical and flat wrong. These people risk their lives, often away from their families, have lousy benefits and working conditions. In other words, cut the salaries of you and your colleagues and raise theirs.
It isn't a pay cut, as they haven't received it yet. It is a reduction in a proposed pay increase. Always funny how words are twisted to accomodate the situation. Just like Congress is cutting spending... yeah right, they are reducing what they are asking for but no where are they cutting spending.
I believe it is you that is missing the point. congress should only make the current avg. single income not a penny more. Being in office should be a privilege not a means of making one wealthy. Eliminating "future" pay increases is just as bad as cutting current salary when it comes to our troops. They are vastly under compensated as it is.
How about you vut the pay of the lazy bums on welfare and disability that don't work...Why do we punish those that work and serve our military when the real people that need to get a pay cut sit at home and collect their welfare checks.
those on disability dont need to work, or only need to work as much as their physical/mental disability allows them to. they are disabled and their condition meets MY criteria for "earning" their keep.
-TheBigSarge
Cut my pay and do not tax me! I was a Navy man and didn't make it a career as I made 75% more as a contractor civilian working for the DOD. Cut their pay say you. Here's a novel idea, cut the pay and exclude them from all state and Federal Income taxes! Thank you for serving.
I would agree to that, however no tax on income made by wages and compensation from service.
As an active duty servicemember, I have to respectfully disagree with your comment. Although I would love to have my pay (all of it) tax-free, the reality is that, were this the case, there would almost certainly be a public outcry. Again, I agree with you in premise, but not principle. I believe it is our job (one of the many) to set the example, not be an exception to the rule. Furthermore, taxes themselves seve as a motivation to take part in a more active democracy.
I served 6 years in the military during the 80s. The equipment, pay, food, etc. were terrible until Reagan gave us a great pay raise, provide much needed new equipment, living quarters, etc. I am now a Federal civilian employee. True we have not had a pay raise in over 3 years, but I would rather have that go to the military. Unless you served, you truly cannot comprehend what the men and women in the military give up to protect this nation and often without the tools necessary to get the job done. Obama, Congress and the Senate are the problem, not the men and women who give up so much so the rest of us can sit back and enjoy our freedom in the safety of our homes.
Well I think Your all way over Paid...When I went in the Army in 1969 My Base pay was $69.00 a mounth being a E1...Try living on that..
@Cosmo- How much was the cost of living back then Cosmo? Also did you volunteer or get volunTOLD? These days to get and keep people that are worth anything you need to pay them a wage that is competetive. Why else would they stay? This country has leaned so far to the left now not many even join to 'serve' anymore. It is all about making a living and getting money for school. Bring back a draft then we can talk about minimum wage pay and putting everyone in tents.
@Cosmo – and when I started out in 1978, I pulled in a whopping $396/month. Of course, I still remember when gas went over $1.00/gal a couple of years later. You can't compare that pay amount without putting it in context with the cost of living at the time.
The cost of living was cheaper.
EVERYTHING was cheaper in comparison with the inflated prices we have today. We have an artificial market and artificial money.
When I was drafted in 1966, mine was $87 a month for an E1.
Cosmos – I just googled Military Pay 1969...E-1 with less than 4 months was paid $115.20 per month and over 4 months was paid $123.30 per month...you also got FREE room...FREE 3 meals a day...and FREE clothing. What Army were you in???
@Cosmo again... Not to beat this into the ground but...we are far from overpaid. I will not even talk about combat deployments or training. This is just our everyday life in garrison I am mentioning here. People also fail to realize that military members do not get overtime at all. We often work 10, 12 or 24 hour days. When we mention that many people will say 'Well you signed up for that' Yes I did. Where were you when I was at the recruiter signing up? I volunteered and did it on my own and stayed. If you were drafted and left that means you were forced then hit the road as soon as you could. Thanks for your service but some of us actually stayed around. by choice and we gave up civilian life and the freedoms and compensation that come with it. Many people do not realize as a grown man I have to ask my commander for PERMISSION to travel certain distances when I am on leave. Hell I have to actually get leave approved that I have earned and they can say no just because they feel like it. Again, another freedom given up and nothing I can do about it. We work weekends, holidays, nights and miss our families events all the time and get nothing else for it like most civilians do. And you say we are overpaid??? I think you are just jealous and failed to do much with yourself after you left the service.
And beyond everything said above, just because you got the shaft, doesn't mean that trend needs to continue. It was wrong then and it's wrong now. It needs to be fixed.
COSMO & Bob Evans – are you honestly comparing present day to the 60's? your low salary was 43 years ago! and gas for 29 cents a gallon..wanna compare that too?
how about congress taking a pay cut?? you cant tell me that they arent overpaid
Agree, Agree, give the forces a raise and cut the senate.
Everyone in Congress should get their pay cut. They make over $170,000 (for life). Asking our military to take a lower pay raise is sinful. Where would we be without them? They risk their lives for all of us and this is what the government does to them. I think we should send our Congress overseas to fight in a war – maybe then they would understand what our military does for our country. Shame on this government.
I have seen my kids try to live on military pay, cut Panetta's and the Pentagon's, President and Congress should not get anything but cuts. Why cut our soldiers in the field?
I have said for years that Federal law should be changed to say that members of Congress should get a salary equal to the average US salary. If Congress is supposed to represent the American people, they should be paid accordingly. The GDP per capita for the US is $44,000 (2006 estimate).
The American combat veteran is the only American who has ever seen his government at its best and at its worst, and can tell you from experience that there’s not much difference between the two.
Historians now believe that the south lost the civil war because generations of inbreeding produced an overwhelming number of mentally challenged soldiers in the Confederate army. And of course today we refer to their decendants as 'tea party patriots'.
Of course, you would know about generations of inbreeding and being mentally challenged.
Actually no. I'm north of the Mason-Dixon.
We should meet sometime. The south must be doing something right because all the smart yankees want to move there. And lets look at states with fiscal problems, which states are they????
What a complete asshat you are..obviously you nothing of the history of which you speak, and what is worse, you decide to label others because they do not prescribe to your views? What a waste of space and oxygen you are!
I'll bet you own an assault weapon.
No I sure don't so you lose that bet.
People in the military make way too much money.
Are you kidding? wow. How much is too much when many still live on food stamps?
John, do you enjoy your freedom and your family's freedom? Put a price on that you friggen moron.
Are you serious? I just pulled in a whopping 16k for the year, which is more than 7k below the 2012 poverty line. Pull your head out of your....
More than you John for being a Fluffer in po*n movies?
they put their lifes in danger everyday , and leave their families so that u can sleep safe at nigth and you think they get pay to much. you should educate your self and speak to one of them or better yet to a military wife like mysefl. think before you open your mouth.
Monica, no tougher job than a military spouse. God bless you and your family
John is just a troll.
John, military paid to much? Our Service Members are very intelligent, extremely versatile, highly skilled, and incredibly resilient. All volunteered to serve despite the fact most could make more money in the civilian sector and not endure the hardships of a nation at war for over a decade. Why? Duty, honor, country!!!!! As a recently retired Infantry Officer in the U.S Army with 28 years of service, during my career I spent approximately 6 to 9 months a year away from my family, fractured/broke my back on 2 separate occasions and more recently in one event sustained over 80 broken bones through out my body. As a result I have lost the functional use of my legs and partial functional use of my hands. I consider myself fortunate as all my limbs are still attached unlike a huge number of my military brothers and sisters. Put a price tag on that. I have no complaints. My injuries were sustained in defense of this great nation and I would do it all over again. What have you done for your country lately?
As usual, FEAR tactics are the norm here. Panetta complains about furloughing 800,000 civilian workers is bad for the economy. What about $1+ trillion dollar annual deficits, Leon?
I'm so glad so many of you love to spout opinions about the Defense budget, but have no idea who it affects and the scope of it. Please save your bluster for something you actually know about before you speak again.
So sayeth Ken – Lord of the Defense Budget. He has spoken!
@saxmanmike: Sir, at least I work for the Department of Defense and have for 13 years. I do know a few things about the budgets as it directly affects my day to day job. Save your sarcasm for the mindless ones. Compared to you, I am "Lord of the Defense Budget".
How about we start with providing absolutely no support to illegal aliens’, period.
Let's try some reading comprehension here:
"But the officials acknowledge it is going to be seen as an effort to push Congress to stop the automatic budget cuts that could go into effect if no deal is reached on spending reductions."
This is politics to put pressure on Congress.
That's one of the things that got us here in the first place- the nanny nanny boo boo, line in the sand, schoolyard mentality of congress and everyone else in this administration.
I am a little upset about the lack of understanding regarding pay and rank, here. A Captain in the Navy is an O-6, same as a Colonel in the Army or USAF and, usually, they have AT LEAST 20 years active duty. Here's the breakdown for a 20 year service O-6 in 20814 or similar area code:
Base Pay: $9529/month (Taxed)
Basic Allowance for Housing: $3141 (Not Taxed)
Basic Allowance for Subsistence: $240.60 (Not Taxed)
Take home after taxes (Assume 2 children, married, Maryland taxes): $10,581.60/month
Equivalent Civilian Pay for his Net: $15,000/month, or $180,000/year.
If he is a physician, he undoubtedly has additional bonuses. For instance, I am a physician in the USAF and my total bonuses each year amount to $42,500/year. Bonuses range widely across the board.
Is this appropriate that he makes so much? That depends. I am a physician and my total gross pay before taxes is the equivalent of $130,000 as I am a Captain (O-3) in the USAF. I am highly trained, well motivated, and score much higher than my civilian peers in the field I practice, consistently getting 80th to 90th percentile on examinations. After graduation from Residency, my civilian peers have jobs making $200,000 to $250,000/year. My highest offer during residency, which I had to turn down of course, was $300,000/year including bonuses. I chose to serve in the military out of a sense of duty and responsibility, not because I was going to "make bank." I am grateful for the pay I am given each month and appreciate the medical benefits. Certainly, there are other career fields that likely make much more in the military vs civilian counterparts, just as many CEOs make much more than the above Captain, who, undoubtedly, has much more responsibility and people underneath him than many CEOs even.
thank you for your service and sacrifices.
But of course you aren't working nearly as you would as a civilian physician, either.
@Bill,
By "But of course you aren't working nearly as you would as a civilian physician, either." you mean he'll sometimes have to be in a combat zone for 6 months – year, be away from home and family for weeks at a time for training purposes, and be ready to kill an enemy at the same time as trying to save a comrade.... you are right he wouldn't work quite like a civilian physician....
Glad you could bring some intelligence to this conversation.
I have to respectfully disagree. While I don't see as many patients per day as many of my sibling counterparts, many of the issues that I see are Much more complex. Furthermore, I don't have the support staff that many of my civilian peers have. Many of my technicians are not as well seasoned as in the civilian world; Therefore I end up doing much more work with each individual patient than those in civilian world would. In general, our clinical notes are much more meticulous, complex, thorough, and all-inclusive than you would run into in the civilian world. Of course, our EMR is complex and buggy.
We could talk about this ad nauseum if you would like, but I don't think everyone else on this board is interested in this conversation.
I apologize for any typos, but I'm using text-to-speech while driving. Yes, I know, but I have no time to make any posts because I am very busy.
Really? When was the last time a civilian resident spent a year on the battlefield? Spent hours in field hospitals treating wounded while rockets and mortars were landing in the compound? My residents spend as much time, oftentimes more, than their civilian counterparts performing rounds, attending lectures and briefings, serving in clinics seeing patients PLUS they have to do all the things required of them because they are in the military (PT tests, mandatory training, PAIs, etc etc)
(No longer in the car) Previous post should read "civilian counterparts," not "sibling counterparts."
Here's the deal: Many civilian physicians have expert support staff including, but not limited to, data entry technicians (write your notes for you), seasoned medical technicians (who obtain much of the history for you), seasoned nurses (who follow-up on telephone calls for you), and the like. In the military, I have none of the above, write my own notes, obtain my own complete histories, follow up on telephone consults myself, and many other tasks other physicians do not have to do. I have worked in civlian clinics before and, although they may see 15+ patients in a half-day of clinic, they routinely work less hours than I. Furthermore, as previously was stated, I also have to (a) endure deployments, (b) PCS every three years (my family [which includes four children] just love tis), (c) take call frequently, (d) stay physically fit, (e) perform my duties as an officer (lots of paperwork, EPRs, OPRs, etc.), (e) work within a large bureaucrocracy, and... I'm sure I'm missing something. Please do not misunderstand me – I am NOT complaining about either my job or my pay. My father, grandfather, and many family members have served in the military and it is my privilege to do so. The pay I get today far exceeds anything ever in the history of the US Military that I am aware of. I am thankful for the opportunity to serve you and your families. I pray that one day I am able to see a broader range of patients (so long as they are interested in bettering their healthcare) and, one day, might be able to serve you directly.
God bless, sir. I thank you very kindly for your own personal duty by paying your own taxes and, humbly, ask you to participate fully in this Democratic experiment so that we do not end up losing our freedoms and privileges.
You all make too much money. As a professional engineer, for 50 years, I don't really come close to those numbers.
Live with it and stop grousing.
Your are case in point why we need a draft, When I was making 30 k a year duing the booming late 90's, I made a sacrfice. 50 yrs of living off the protection of others and now u complain.
Jon, how many years did you work where your life was on the line? That's what I thought.
@Jon- Get over it buddy. Maybe if you were smarter you could have been a doctor. It is not my fault you did something else. Maybe Obama has a job training project for old men you can milk for a few years.
Jon,
I'm not complaining about pay; quite the opposite. My initial post was in response to an individual who was upset that the Navy Captain could afford a house in Washington D.C. area he was living in. I repeat – I am not complaining. Regarding my own pay, the point I was trying to make is that we often don't make as much as our civilian counterparts, not more. If you ask me, I think civilian doctors, in general, make too much money (and this, coming from a physician) in addition to many Lawyers, CEOs, etc. Just my two cents.
Jon – You are absolutely correct. As a 20 year engineer myself, everyone in our industry has been frustrated at one time or another regarding doctor pay versus professional engineering pay. As we both know, the difference is that an engineer can take out hundreds of lives with one mistake when a doctor takes just one. It never will make any sense as to the differences in liability versus pay.
Stuart,
You provide a great glimpse into the military salary. Please keep in mind that the volunteer service is going places that the bus driver or trash collector in Los Angeles will never go (Iraq and Afghanistan) and have more responsibility, and come back dismantled. I know, they volunteered. With responsibility and separation from home, the pay check is less than his civilian equivalent. I know the point you bring up to the group has some validity, but I would look at the higher ups. The Navy has more admirals than ships. During WW II, there was 1 admiral for 10 ships. Then, think about the jobs those officers get when they retire! Right now many enlisted sailors are being separated without the opportunity to get that pension. It actually makes sense. Why? The Navy is getting rid of the mediocre service member. No one solution, but manpower reductions were made so that cost of living raises could be received. I would put a pay freeze for 10 years on all of our elected officials in Dysfunctional Central, as well as a 20% pay cut. They are already getting free health care and insider trading information for stocks and bonds. Oh wait, they had to pass a law to stop corruption….
Also, thank you for your service.
I completely understand where you are going with this but what about your enlisted members? I am an E-5 and in a high demand IT job where I could be making well over 90K a year in my current position but in the military I am making significantly less. Is my health care and housing taken care of yes. But I still only have a take home of about 40k a year. The argument is both ways. Some people are getting paid too much and some not.
@Jon- When it comes time to reenlist, don't.
This, unfortunately, is why I have very few highly qualified technicians and why I constantly seem to be training new ones.
Captain-
Who paid for your college and medical school? Were you in the ROTC? If so that is your choice and obligation. You did not have to sign the dotted line.
Sir, in no way was I complaining about my pay. I am very thankful for what I am paid, but in no way am I overpaid. Yes, I did ROTC and, afterwards, went to USUHS. I owed the military a total of 14 years of active service including Residency training before I can even consider getting out of the military, let alone retiring.
Correct, however there are more indians than chief's in the military. I think showing what the average E-5 family living in a mid-west area brings home would paint a more realistic picture. We're not all physicians.
I apologize, but the original post was directed towards the individual who was angry that the Navy O-6 could afford the house he had reportedly purchased in the Washington D.C. area. I mean no offense regarding pay equity in the enlisted ranks. Let us, then, change the conversation:
Assume, an E-5, 10 years of service, married, with two children living in Junction City, KS:
Base Pay: $3046
BAH: $1155 (not taxed)
BAS: $352.27 (not taxed)
Uniformed (Enlisted only): $309/year, (I'm assuming Army hence Ft. Riley, KS; not certain if taxed)
Net Pay: $4186/month, $50,200/year
Equivalent Civilian gross for the above net: $61,000/year
So the typical E-5 in Midwestern US who is married with two children makes the equivalent of approximately $60,000/year; this calculation does not include medical benefits (Dental benefits for dependents is not entirely worth mentioning here). I hope this is more enlightening.
I beleive that the military is under paid. The contract military make more then our military. US military 1200/month contract 12000/month. I beleive that when a person is in a combat zone, all bills at home are on hold, thats house, car,
and house hold issues stop. The military person who is is serving all of us is not concerned about their family going broke. Increase the pay they deserve it. And when they come home give them insurance that can be used anywhere not just at the VA. If they want to use the VA system thats fine. But the freedom to choose. Ron
Contract Military!! You mean Mercs! Cause that's essentially what they are ... and most all of them are prior service and then chose to contract ... the same choice every other service member has when their initial commitment is up ... if they choose to reenlist then my hat's off to them and thank you for your service, but no recruiter or retention NCO I know of has every used the slogan "Join the military ... we'll make you rich!"
Jon,
Unless you've already got your BS in Computer Science/IT to go with your military training/experience then your living in a dream world if you think you'd get a civilian job in IT making $90k. $35-45k would be more like it depending on location and then you'd still have to pay for your own housing and health insurance. I know plenty of people in the military that have no idea how the civilian world is right now and think they'll just get out making bank because of their military training/experience. It isn't true ... especially in an employer's economy with 9% unemployment. My advice is ... if you can't live on $40k a year ... then stay in the service … because you'll be hurting if you get out.
And before you try to us the old "you must not know what it’s like to serve" let me just say I did 7 years active duty Marines and have been 8 years in the Army National Guard.
Well I sure hope they don't cut the funding for all the seasonal landscaping around the military bases and HQ buildings. That would be horrible.
Haha I do agree with this, a lot of money is wasted through contractors.
Here's something to consider. I know someone who retired as an Army Major and the very next day sat back down at his desk, doing the exact same job at full pay as a civilian contractor while collecting his pension. How many of these double dippers are out there and how much is this costing the taxpayers? And why is this never part of the discussion or covered by the media? End the double dipping nonsense and apply the funds toward paying those doing the fighting.
the government probably should get away from pensions and go to a 401k like everyone else
The government did away with the Civil Service Retirement System(CSRS) in the early 80's. It was replaced with the Federal Employees Retirement System (FERS) that gives retirees a small pension, not the large government pension of years ago that everyone thinks retirees still receive. The old system paid a pension but retirees were not paid Social Security since they never paid into it. Government employees now have the Thrift Savings Plan (TSP) which is like a 401k and since they pay into SS, they also receive it. So, the old system was replaced by a small pension, TSP and SS.
The government provides the TSP (Thrift Savings Plan) to its employees, which operates exactly like a 401(k). So, pension + 401(k).
Lol.
The Government switched from the okld, very sweet, retirement system to a more "Corporate" like system years ago so that comment is a bit off. As far as anyone wanting to limit "pay raises" for enlisted; remember that they really are NOT "pay raises" but rather cost of living adjustments to keep up with raising costs. To get a true "pay raise" you have to advance in rank; not an automatic thing.
Sure as soon as civilians are willing to move every 3 years, get 1/2 of thier normal pay, be on call 24/7, and leave their spouses/kids for as much as 15 months at a time, yea getting rid of the 20 yr pension makes sense. That "double-dipping" comment was also not well thought out. That major earned his pension, why shouldnt he benefit. And oh by the way, the military still pay taxes as well. Make sure to be well informed before making comments.
Nip
I am a 35 year retired Federal Worker who worked for the Army. I have seen tons of new workers hired that were retired
Military. The people would draw a Military retirement while drawing a decent Federal salary. Plus their wives often had jobs
in the Govt. Plus they took about $450.00 a month out of my salary for Health Care while the Retired Military worker would not get the Health insurance because they were on Tri-Care-the Military retirement Health Insurance. Where on this earth can a guy draw a pension from the Govt. while he works for the Govt? Does this seem wasteful to you?.
By the way I am a Vietnam Vet but really some of the benefits in place for the Military are insane and wasteful.
Why does it matter whether you get a job with the government or with someone else after retirement? Are you actually stupid enough to think that a military pension is enough to live on after retiring? Stop being angry because a lot of people are smarter than you.
first we need to cut the corporate phone line to 911 marines and let these idiots handle the mess they create in other countries. This proposal is as bad as the one were they wanted to pay the troops by the hour. Maybe as part of Panetta's retirement package we give him a gun and drop him in the middle of the combat zone. I wonder if he would think 1.7% was too much then.
Let see if I understand this now, they want to cut the military pay, the pay to the very people that defend this country, yet Congress and every other politician wants more and more pay to themselves while they sit of their fat asses and make laws and submit more and more bills that they themselves are exempt from. Makes sense to me, actually the only thing that makes sense is to vote every one of them that votes for this riduculous idea out of office. I know I will.
Oh well... And whom do we have to thank?! The "Clueless One."
Panetta doesn't want to cut one dime from that fraud, waste and abuse called the Pentagon, but wants to limit military pay. He claims our readiness will be affected. Exactly how does he think our readiness will be affected if they limit pay? OMG, he MUST be kidding!
Welcome to Washington, where a pay raise that's scaled back is a pay cut and eliminating deductions/exemptions isn't a tax increase.
Cut the pay to the people who are in the field, risking their lives to insure our freedom?
SERIOUSLY???
Cut something else, bring them all home, but don't punish THEM for the problems that CONGRESS has created.
Nobody in the military is receiving a pay cut. Not receiving a raise is not a cut. Hyperbole.
The cost of living is an automatic pay cut. It reduces the value (buying power) of the dollars they/we get.
Failing to (AT LEAST) keep up with the cost of living IS, absolutely, a "pay cut" by virtue of the reduced buying power.
The only part of your comment I don't understand is where you make it sound like maybe Congress gives a sweet one about anyone except themselves and their campaign contributors.
It's about time America woke up and voted ALL members of both houses out of office and elected some REAL people, not lawyers and bankers, and passed laws and tax rules that are fair. The days of control by the greedy, lazy have it all segment of society, is about to end, peacefully or otherwise.
I am retired military. They need to cut all of our elected officials pay by 15%. Obama needs to take back the recent raise he gave to all his so called hard working members especially the joke of a VP. Our elected officials aren't putting their life on the line everyday. Support the ones who are really protecting our freedom the only protect going on is to the elected officials so they can line their pockets
"Obama" did not give anyone a raise, Congressional or otherwise. Congress legislates spending not the President. Congress votes for spending costs, not the President. I too am a retired military man. I spent 22 years wearing a uniform but I am not ignorant.
Actually, President Obama ended a pay freeze. That allowed a predetermined pay increase to go forward
Obama is ignorant and arrogant.
No ones implying you're ignorant. Congress made a public statement that they would not take pay raises this year and the president implied that he wanted them to accept raises anyway.
okay they gave us a 1.7% raise but taxed us 2.4%. I just don't see how that helped at all.
I would imagine that teabagger's heads have been exploding left and right ever since their fearless leader Sarah Palin was broomed from Faux News.
If you're going to engage in an open dialogue, at least stay on the subject. Otherwise, go back to the "Democratic Underground" and leave your comments, twit. Adults are trying to have a discussion here.
Better hurry back to your double-wide. Nascar's on.
What does that have to do with anything?
That's precisely the type of response I'd expect from someone who actually believes Palin said she could see Russia from her house. Hope you like your Obamaphone.
PLEASE, don't encourage him by engaging in any kind of dialogue pertaining to his ignorance... It only shows yours.
Grow a brain
LMAO. Obamaphone. He isn't the one who started giving these out. But, may as well blame it on him, eh?
Real "Liberals" are annoyed by trolls like you too.
I know, I am one and you are nothing more than a blight on any chance of civil conversation.
Back under your bridge.
Go back and finish your latte, George.
You're just an a$$!
Again you are a complete asshat....
Don't look now Goober but someone is trying to hotwire your tractor.
Interestingly enough, I do not own a tractor, nice try though
Jim, not sure about you but we do pay for our medical. a certain amount comes out of our pay to cover our medical. how about all the tricare raised fees Obama just put out but isn't touching the medical of the military contracted civilians who are on the same medical program as the active duty members. so not only do we pay for our medical we will also be pay more for it. also not every member of the military gets all those extra pays you are talking about. some members are essential to say state side to support those in the combat areas. so saying they have all those extra pays is not actually true. i said it in a past post and here it is again.. they do not get money for food. you are talking about the basic soldier that is in a combat zone. not all the military are soldiers or in a combat zone or will see one, but they are still essential to everything those soldiers do. there are actually thousands and thousands of military members deployed every single day that get no hazarded pay and no combat pay at all. there is no TAX FREE combat pay if you don't get combat pay while your deployed. not sure if you checked but this affects the whole military. not just the combat deployed soldier.
...and taxes just went up, meaning military members are seeing higher deductions in their paychecks. If a military member pays taxes in one state, those taxes are also being taken out (even if they live in a state income tax free state like Texas).
There was a reduction in payroll taxes, specifically the Social Security payroll tax that was "reduced" by 2%. It was enacted under the Obama Administration and lasted for 2 years, 2011 and 2012. The SS payroll tax went from 6.2% down to 4.2%. The 7.65% tax rate is the combined rate for Social Security and Medicare. The Social Security portion (OASDI) is 6.20% on earnings up to the applicable taxable maximum amount ($110K). The Medicare portion (HI) is 1.45% on all earnings. The Temporary Payroll Tax Cut Continuation Act of 2011 reduced the Social Security payroll tax rate by 2% on the portion of the tax paid by the worker through the end of February 2012. The Middle Class Tax Relief and Job Creation Act of 2012 extended the reduction through the end of 2012. Under current law, this temporary reduction expires at the end of December 2012. The legislation was meant to be temporary not permanent. It was written that way and approved by Congress. Obama signed it in to law. Nobody would have received the reduction for those two years if it were nt fr the Obama Administration approving it, so to claim he is raising taxes is pretty damn ignorant.
There was a reduction in payroll taxes, specifically the Social Security payroll tax that was "reduced" by 2%. It was enacted under the Obama Administration and lasted for 2 years, 2011 and 2012. The SS payroll tax went from 6.2% down to 4.2%. The 7.65% tax rate is the combined rate for Social Security and Medicare. The Social Security portion (OASDI) is 6.20% on earnings up to the applicable taxable maximum amount ($110K). The Medicare portion (HI) is 1.45% on all earnings. The Temporary Payroll Tax Cut Continuation Act of 2011 reduced the Social Security payroll tax rate by 2% on the portion of the tax paid by the worker through the end of February 2012. The Middle Class Tax Relief and Job Creation Act of 2012 extended the reduction through the end of 2012. Under current law, this temporary reduction expires at the end of December 2012. The legislation was meant to be temporary not permanent. It was written that way and approved by Congress. Obama signed it in to law. Nobody would have received the reduction for those two years if it were not for the Obama Administration approving it, so to claim he is raising taxes is pretty damn ignorant.
Congress tried cutting military pay a few decades ago and it backfired rather horribly. We ended up with a shortage of people in the "middle" ranks because they had left for far better paying jobs in the private sector. It was a sort of bubble in reverse. In any event, it "popped."
I don't see how this is even remotely a good idea.
They really need to cut the pay of the military. There is a Navy Captain in my neighborhood, wife does not work, purchased a house that cost 1.27M dollars! Now I realize they get a cost of living adjustment, and a housing allowance if living off base – and the DC area is expensive. But common! His mortgage is probably 8k a month after the ( high ) property taxes in our area. So thats 72k a year just in mortgage payments. In order to qualify for that loan, he needs to make at least 200k a year after said adjustments. If the guy was an Admiral I would understand, but there are 10x as many Captains as Admirals – no way they should be making 200k a year.
I'm sure there is a good explanation for this. A Captain in the Navy gets paid the same as a Captain in any other military branch. Just because the branch changes the pay grade (Capts are O3) dont. He must have other sort of investments outside the military or something.
Capt in the Navy/CG is an O-6, Army, Air Force and Marines it's an O-3
Actually, the navy uses Captain to mean 0-6, so his base pay is somewhere between $72k and $108k. Not sure what he's getting in extra hazardous pay.
A Capt in the Navy is not the same as a Capt in the other branches FYI. The equivalence of a Navy Capt is a Colonel in other branches. Thanks
Juan. A Capt. in the Navy is a 0-6, the equivalent of a Colonel in the other services. The Navy Capt in question is actually only one rank below an Admiral. Pay scales for all ranks are easily accessible online.
Correct...he may have been buying and selling homes at each duty station for profit...know an enlisted person that bought and sold real estate in the UK for about 15 years while stationed there...came back and now lives in a neighborhood "he does not belong in" (according to some a s s wipes posting here)...and no mortgage...its called capitalism.
Frank, as an active duty military member, I can tell you that OUR pay scale is PUBLIC and if you take the time to look it up you will see that a captain does not make $200k a year in salary. We do get BAH/BAS and that helps with offsetting the pay difference between the civilian sector and the military. Also, why is it any of your concern what his housing payments are? Is it your house. NO. Mind your own business. You have no idea. Who says he didn't deploy back to back and EARN his salary tax free for a year or two or three? Who says he didn't get an enlistment/reenlistment bonus on top of that? And if he reenlisted in a COMBAT ZONE, that is tax free also. He could have had a massive amount to put down on a house. Who says he didn't lose a loved one and inherit a massive amount of money? Possibilities are endless. Either way, it's none of your business.
I can assure you that a retired Navy Captain does not make anything like what you're suggesting. You don't suppose he may have done some responsible financial planning over the course of a 30 year career, do you? Or perhaps his or his wife's family were well off and inherited a substantial sum?
I notice you live in the area, they must be paying you too much. As a 100% permanently and totally disabled in-the-line-of-duty veteran, medically retired from the U. S. Navy, I can assure you that I'd give back the money I've been paid down through the years in a second if I could get rid of my service connected disabilities.
You assume too much about your neighbor to speak to it. You're a prime example of why I'd support universal conscription under which EVERYBODY serves, NO EXCEPTIONS. Unless you're comatose, you wear a uniform and we'll find you a job commensurate with your abilities. Four years. I'll wager there wouldn't be any whining about military remuneration or veterans benefits then. If they ever pass such a wonderful program, send me a postcard from Canada.
Tell them! Brilliant Rick!
A navy captain is the same as a full colonel in the army.
O-7 over 8,000 dollars per month
Navy Captain is an O6. Monthly base pay at 24 years service is 10,034. O7 is a Rear Admiral (LH).
As long as your are speculating, how about this. Maybe he has other sources of honest income he pays taxes on. He may have won a lottery. He may made a large down payment or paid cash using money from other investments. He may have inherited the money. The possibilities are endless. And you are probably right, he probably cannot afford the house if he is living paycheck to paycheck on a Captains salary. Say he did have 1.7M in cash. Would you be happier if he were living in a 150K house with the rest of the money invested in the stock market or in an off shore bank? At least now he has 1.7M less than before and that money has been re-distributed into the local economy.
Cant help myself, one more comment. "..In your neighborhood." ?? Really!!
Wow, what a thinly veiled argument. Instead of focusing on the larger question of what capabilities a modern-day military needs, and whether the US military budget should be 40% of the entire global spend, he is trying to change the discussion and gain sympathy by limiting pay raises. Soldiers do a difficult and important job and deserve to be fairly paid and received decent raises. And this we can absolutely afford. What we cannot afford is limitless spending on defense programs whose value doesn't justify their cost. The solution to the defense cuts is not to deny soldiers a pay raise, but to adjust the size and capabilities of the military to meet the countries needs. This happens in business every day and in all other parts of the government, but somehow we only care when servicepeople lose their jobs?
What an incredibly dumb argument. We need to have a serious and objective discussion and to likely make some hard choices and I would have expect our leads to be part of the solution, not inflame the emotions. We can do better.
We'd all like to have an honest and open debate about this, Ken. But whenever anyone in DC tries to engage the matter, the President says "sit down, shut up, and let me have my way". That's not very honest and open to me.
A good comment, even if I suspect both sides deserve some of the blame. However, regardless of who's politics you subscribe to, the fact remains that we spend more money on the military than we need to. I have heard of no credible reason why we need to sustain these high levels of spending when the money could be used for much better purposes (be it tax cuts or infrastructure and education).
What we need is for all the House and all the Congress to stop accepting ANY pay until they compromise on a reasonable budget where everyone makes sacrifices across the board, themselves FIRST. We need grown up leaders. Throw them all out in the next election.
What we need to do is hold the government accountable just like they do us, we have to go by a budget and stick to it. We can not get a loan everytime we want or think we need something. I don't see anyone in my family going out to pilfer money from anyone else and neither should our government. If we fall behind on our bills, they either shut off the services or foreclose on us. Can you imagine the government foreclosing on the white house? (I know it won't happen, just a figure of speech.) The other way to maybe cut back is to stop giving other countries our money, shoot half of them would rather see us dead. That's like giving an ungrateful relative money and all they do is crap on you. We can not pay countries to like us and that is what it seems like. Keep our money here!
Agreed.
I don't know how the GOP can sleep at night. Protect the rich make them richer and take from our military, public safety, old, teachers, etc. Well enjoy your toys because your day will come.
DO not blame the republicans alone, Democrats are just as responsible. At least the Republican controled house passed a budget, where is the Senate budget? IF nothing else we need to cut goverment spending on social programs and increase Military spending, 80% of our trade travels by water, we need a strong Navy.
It's nice that some spending cuts will finally be made that will hit conservatives as well. Just think, millions of dark skinned non-christians living in sovereign countries free from foreign occupiers and being allowed to keep their own oil. Oh, the horror!
Trollin'.
FIRST ON CNN: Panetta to recommend pay cut for military
Cutting the Pay of the People who are supposed to protect us at a moments notice is –
STUPID
It's the Truth –
Being in the Military and being a Military Family should have the same intangible rewards as any profession.
Benefits & Pay
Increase the Benefits & Increase the Pay –
Then 'raise the bar' for the enlisted personnel and the officers
You end up with a Better Overall group.
And if the Military is Happy, so is the Country........
Think About it....
Keith Grant
TRUTHABOUTHECIA.ORG
I have an option. Stop trying to police the entire world. It doesn't work and is bankrupting the country while making defense contractors, and others, rich at our expense. The military budget has enormous amounts of waste but cutting or even limiting the pay of those who serve is not the way to go.
You know our military use to be self sufficient but now everything is contracted out (cooks, mechanics, maint., etc.) and the work these ppl do is crap. My husband is deployed right now and he tells me the waste of money he sees on contracted work. The rich get richer and the people that do the hard work gets shafted.
Dena,
Thanks to your family for your service. I can't believe this. You should be getting raises, but then they might have to cut a few of the high-dollar tanks and planes that are becoming less and less needed as we move to different types of warfare. It's just not right.
I saw the same thing while deployed in Iraq, companies hire unqualified people, using the cheapest material and charging a forture for it. The individual that write government contacts should be fired, they allow to much bs put in them, no fines for doing bad work, the contact alway need to Mod for some reason or another. I saw so much waste in would make you sick, I was in a rear area it was sickening to see, it gave me a new meaning of IN the REAR with the GEAR. Soldiers are the FOB were the last priority, people in the rear took care of themselves first.
I can hear it now.... Jay Carney at tomorrow's press conference: "The President supports the troops 100% and wishes he could give them a substantial raise for teh courageous work they do... but the Republicans (Bush) can't give us a reasonable budget and that's why we're FORCED to cut military pay." What a load of crap! BO spends billions on ObamaCare, but can't pay soldiers. BO spends billions on electric cars that no one can afford, but can't pay soldiers. BO spends billions on "Green Energy" companies that then go bankrupt or send their jobs to China, but can't pay soldiers. BO send his wife to India on vacation that costs almost 20 million tax dollars, but can't pay soldiers. Yeah, right. It must be the Republicans fault. NOT!
Well said Matko, I could not agree more.
There is so much waste in Govt. including the Military-lets be honest. Also in all Govt. jobs. The Govt. gives preference
to retired Military in Govt. jobs where the person draws a Military pension and makes a decent Govt. Salary. Also Govt. contractors provide people who do Govt. jobs that pay the worker the same salary as the Govt. person bdoing the exact same job–the contractors company makes the same as the contracted worker. In other words the Govt. pays $100,000 for a job that should cost $50,000–how is this smart? And currently there are tons of contractors working for the Govt. I knew a guy who worked for the Army as a contractor for 23 years–these jobs need to be brought in-house. Military spending must be cut in all areas we cannot afford gold plating anymore. I am not sure if cutting the pay of the military people is the right thing to do but other areas are ripe for reform.
Panetta is a joke. What military experience does he have?. I suspect none, because if he did he'd see paying our Soldiers what they are worth. Now it seems he wants to cut the very funds that American's risk their lives for. How about all the vendors of military equipment taking pay cuts, like haliburton and companies like that? Friggin politican's always want to wade into the shallow end of the pool.
Cuts in defense? Sure, so many redundent programs as to be asinine (do we really need sailors to have blue camo's so if they fall in teh water it makes them HARDER to find), we have hundreds of military programs that even the military doesn't want, but because they are in Congressman X or Senator Y's area, they are being pushed down their throats.
Yes...cut the defense budget, but be smart about it. Also, just a thought, don't sell our F16s, tanks, military equiment, to countries that are unstable and damn sure not our ally!
Why do we continue to fund the Thunderbirds, Blue Angels, Black Knights, all the military bands, Tops in Blues etc....
Maybe its time all these BS programs go away, they were supposed to be recruiting tools and now they are a waste because there are more people than the military can afford.
TBONE, its Golden Knights not Black Knights.
Great point!
Love me some T-Birds, Angels, Knights...
The image these teams of uber warriors project to the world is worth it's weight in gold. If you flew Mig-29's, you'd have nightmares that an F-35 pilot, formerly a Blue Angel and Top Gun winner, killed you before you ever knew he was there.
Personally, I like watching the Knights jump in sporting events, etc. Should we have more Kardashians, perhaps?
Your example of sailors' camo's as a "redundant program" is rediculous. Sailors need everyday work uniforms just as much as the Army, AF, or Marines. It doesn't cost any more to make them in blue camo as it does in brown or green. Maybe you 'd consider having different colors of cars, rather than all being black, as being 'redundant'.
One thing that could be addressed is the "Age 38 Retirement " That burdens the military 'for life'. No where else can you go into ajob at 18, retire after 20 years at 38, and immediately get a retirement check every month for the rest of your life. In industry, you have to wait until you are 55 to "retire" and then that is considered early retirement and the retirement money is reduced severely, typically by 25% . Not the military..you get the "full ride" after 20 years regardless of age..
Z_2K..the retire at 38 is not a "full ride" as you would indicate. Military personnel entering today get 40% of their base pay at 20 yr retirement and add 3.5% per year served after that. 40% of final base pay minus federal and state taxes and after the 6% survivors benefit plan does hardly leaves anything to live on. The has never been a full ride under any of the three retirement plans...where did you hear that?
People in industry do not get deployed to combat zones. I knew an Air Force guy, deployed 11 times (3 to Iraq) in 20 years, mostly on the ground, with convoys, not flight duty. I would say he earned his retirement. He was lucky to live to see it.
Are you serious? What other profession do you work as hard as a military member? Most deploy to hostile environments at least twice in a career (for months at a time). Have you ever served? The extent of what is sacrificed as a soldier, sailor, airman, or marine is well worth the early retirement at 38!! And that's only for those that come in at 18.
Many civilians change jobs 2/3/4 times over a career. Here you have an individual investing 20 years in the military, applying his/her knowledge each year in their performance. That should earn the right to secure a retirement income and not hinder their chosing a second profession...which may be in government. If double dipping is the concern, then perhaps those that move to govt position should have immediate buy-in for their 20 years of service and solidify their path to govt retirement.
Yet Congress ensures they keep getting large pay raises for their part time job.
When do "we the people" get some say in their pay?
The last pay raise congress voted itself was in 2009. Get the facts before opening the mouth. They do get automatic adjustments, however they voted to suspend them in 2010 and 2011. I cannot find if they did so for 2012.
They spend over 80% of the military budget of high tech heavy weapon programs that are used in large wars that we don't use or need. And they want to cuz the soldiers pay? That's fuked up,we can spend more than the next top ten country's combined but we cant pay our troops.
As an Active Duty Marine, I have to say that if this cut happens it will hurt so many military families. I have seen so many of my fellow Marines in my unit, both single and married, have to go out and get second jobs just to make ends meet. Some have even gotten out just so they can try and get a higher paying career. What people fail to realize is that many of our servicemembers are mid-class and low-class citizens. They rely on that paycheck not only for themselves, but the majority of them sacrifice a significant amount of that check to help out family back home as well. We make more sacrfices than most think. If this cut goes throgh I can't even begin to think of the cost of it may be.
Our military should be the highest paid individuals on the planet not the lowest. We maintain our freedom because of their williness to protect and sacrifice for the ir country. To ask them for pay cuts or to limit their raises to 1% is an outrage. Less we forget the time away from their families, the conditions they live in when in Afghanistan. The daily chances they take being shot at, bombs going off. They are not at the HILTON. Congress, company CEO's make more money then they know what to do with. Why don't we give them all a big pay cut, no raises, no huge tax cuts and use that money to take care of our military. Hell, right now most of the military enlisted can't even be considered lower class, but don't let them voice any opposition to being on call 24 x 7. The United States of America is the greatest nation and it became that way on the back of our military. They should be respected, revered and honored not spit on.
Are you ready to pay the taxes to support your statements?
Juan, you are so right. They should cut congress's pay by 10% and give that to the military who put their lives in harm's way for the rest of us! Just so you know most of the regular Americans are behind you 100%!
"President Obama in 2012 walled off military pay from cuts"
Why/ Oh yeah, votes.
No. Because the last time it was tried, it "blew up" in our faces.
So,....you're saying he shouldn't have walled-off cuts to the soldiers pay?? Can you apprieciate that he did that or not? – votes aside, your snideness doesn't address something important to military families who serve YOU.
Hell, limit Congress's pay raise!! They aren't preparing to go get shot at. The military is!! Everyone is in love with the troops until it's time to pay them. Mr. Panetta, you just proved why you should no longer be the SECDEF. You have no compassion for men and women who are putting their lives on the line for this country and want to compensate them pennies for doing it. Some have families with school-aged children. A 1% pay raise does nothing but put them in another tax bracket. It does not help put food on the table. When the war draws down, will you be putting Congressmen and Senators out of work?? No!! You will start putting the same men who fought dilligently for this beloved country of ours, out on the streets. This is a bad idea.. Tell congress to vote their pay raise down...
Anyone is a position to do anything with the military, telling them where to go, when to go, and how they must stay, should have at least experienced it. If you can tell someone to go out and fight for you then you must have served in the reserve, guard, or active duty. How can you be the cook if you don't know how to cook.
Congress works maybe 3 or 4 days, not always 8 hrs, get pay raises on a regular basis, when they retire they continue to get paid with full benefits until they die. Our military does not even get that. So don't tell me congress isn't over paid. I think if they would forfeit their pay once in awhile the american people would have more respect for them. But they aren't willing to cut anything but the things they shouldn't.
The government wants to be protected but treat the ones that protect us like dogs.
Well there is civilians who eat better and live off tax payers money...PRISONERS is one of the people. how is that fair? You talking about the people who are protecting the world and you got entertainers, athletes, CEO making more. Yall can say what you want to. Soliders, Police, Teachers, Fire Fighters are ALL UNDERPAID. And the TROOPS come home having nightmares, having hard times working with others cause of what they went through. Sad world we live in. Won't even take care of our own
Its not like they were drafted
Small mind you have.
Um, Tom? What does being drafted have anything to do with the discussion – or military service for that matter?
they are not cutting pay... just failing to give an increase. Govt employees have not had a cost of living increase in three years. Are they not Govt. employees?
And how many government employee's get shot at every day?
Oh wait, you quite obviously don't give a crap about that.
f'n moron
Well, they all don't get shot at everyday. Those in war zones maybe. What about the ones stationed in non-combat zones? Cops also get shot at.
Of course, while in war zones, they get a bonus and I believe tax exemptions. That's why many of them go back.
But are they the ones who spend years away from their families?? It's easy to make stupid comments when you have lived it.
*when you have NOT lived it.*
Weak sauce, Tom. Gov't employees get paid more than their civilian counterparts, but you knew that. Move along.
True, but they also get matching in their 401K. Military retirement is all or nothing. For 80% they never retire from the military and never get anything towards retirement.
How about we cut the pay to these useless congressmen that can't seem to be able to do the job they were elected to do.
Even mentioning cutting pay to our servicemen is a disgrace!!
Cut the pay on those that don't perform and WE KNOW who you are you congressional fools.
If you were paid by performance you'd owe US money.
Don't just suspend their pay. FIRE THEM in the next elections. If you have a worker who is performing a sub-standard job, and you're paying them an exhorbitant amount of money, wouldn't you just fire them too?
Well said. Can we just send them on a tour of duty in Afghan?
Typical CNN is anyone's fault except Obama. How about putting blame where it belongs you cowards. Come on grow a pair stop supporting this "President". It's no wonder CNN is going under.
You know that sequestration was suggested by the Republican-dominated congress, don't you?
Unfortunately, you are as clueless as most of his other supporters. This suggestion came from the White House and was NOT the ideal of Republicans.
Here is a quote from Politico for you:
"Woodward reports in his book that White House Office of Management Director Jack Lew and Legislative Affairs Director Rob Nabors took the proposal for sequestration to Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, and then it was presented to congressional Republicans."
Low information commentators are the bread and butter that CNN relies on for both their viewers and their readers.
You know they did that so the Democrats would pass a budget like they are required to by law and haven't done in 4 years...right?
"Ciivilian". You REALLY need to familiarize yourself with details and facts before banging out a few sentences on a keyboard – and quit watching CNN because it's polluting your mind.
I do remember Boehner getting 98% of what he wanted out of that deal.
As republicans are so fond of saying when discussion the Iraq war, republicans signed off on it. It's as much your problem as it is democrats.
Budget Control Act of 2011. Voted for by Republican congressmen 174-66 (Democrats 45-45, Senate Republicans 28-19, Senate Democrats 45-6). Hard to blame this one on Obama.
OK.. let's put the blame where it really belongs. On the President who started this mess in the first place. Your "boy" George W. Bush. Had he not had the John Wayne mentality about the WMD's that have yet to be found, we would not have been in Iraq spending $12B per month. That is $144B per year. Multiply that times the 8 years we've been there and that will total a bit over $1 trillion bucks.. BTW.. Where is W? Have you seen or heard from him lately??
A
The weapons were found.
They are the same weapons that Obama is now scared of because they are in Syria.
Just like the CIA told you back then.
For whatever reason, your ilk just dont listen.
Bush was told to move fast because the weapons were being moved from Iraq to Syria to hide them.
And thats what they did.
WIth due respect to our soldiers (and they DO deserve respect), the military should not be immune from budget cuts. Some people here seem to think that the military should get any and every thing it wants. Not so. They are not the elites of our society. They do their jobs excellently, and I support them. But they are still AMericans like the rest of us, and we all have to make changes if we're to get our fiscal house in order. If you don't want their pay cut, how about telling your senator to cut the joint strike fighter and give half the savings to the combat soldiers as a salary increase? And remember, everyone will cry "The sky is Falling!" when their budget is cut. But the reality is that any part of our government can do its job with less money, but only if they are forced to do so. So let's get on with it.
Sid
Sid
You are aware that when you cut the budget that goes into the defense of this nation you are making yourself and everyone else more vulnerable, right? No the military shouldn't be "immune" to anything, but if you cut the budget to almost a 1/3 of its cost you can take us to being the most powerful military on the planet to the top 5. I don't know about you, but I want to be number 1 in that category with the way the world is.
No. If we cut our military spending to 1/3 of its current levels we would still spend far more than China and Russia combined. We spend almost as much as every other country in the world combined. It is completely ridiculous how much we spend on our military. We don't need to spend that much to be "safe."
As a former Govt. employee (Working with military daily) I can assure you there are plenty of useless employees and soldiers. I worked with guys who did nothing every single day, knowing it would take YEARS of paperwork to get them fired (So no one bothered). There were similar people on the military side. I'd rather see this fixed and the removal of some of these people than their pay getting cut across the board.
Either way, the idea that a small cut in our spending would endanger us is absurd. If anything, cutting our miltary budget might make us less likely to get involved in useless wars like Iraq.
STOP paying mercenaries ENTIRELY...same services at 10 times the cost...you can see why the GOP love it.
Just read about the near weekly trips Panetta takes back to California at the taxpayers expense (no secret). I guess there were a few pilots in the AF that were not getting their hours cut back, haha. It seems Panetta has refused to provide receipts or anything else connected to his flights home. Sure wish I could afford to fly across the country weekly on my huge military pay. Wait, I forgot, he needed that to clear his head and it 99% of it doesn't come out of his pay, lol. Why not allow those currently placed in harms way to commute back weekly to clear their heads? He gets paid a huge salary to deal with those problems and nobody is even shooting at him and obviously he isn't missing his wife because he sees her weekly.
This is not a pay CUT, it's a 1% pay RAISE. Civilian federal employees have had 0% pay raise for the past three years. It's a recession, suck it up.
Are you telling those employees who get their butt's shot at, to take less pay and "suck it up?" Why should those who are consistently being put in harms way have to "suck it up" even more than they already do? So you can continue to receive you big, fat federal government paycheck? Why don't all non-essential federal employees (which is most of them by the way) take a 10% pay cut...and just "suck it up." Why don't those receiving welfare, extended un-employment benefits, food stamps, and foreign aid take a 20% cut and "just suck it up." Why does this nation always target the military families first when it comes to sacrifice? You don't want to pay us for our sacrifice? For our training? Our readiness? Fine. Let's go back to the draft and see how everyone likes that option.
Well said from another Military Wife. Most ppl have no idea and I think the draft would make every feel how it is to serve "their" country and see what the Military familes go through.
Quite a few errors in your response there. First of all, I'm not telling them to "take less pay." They're getting a 1% pay increase, which tracks inflation pretty well. Previously, they've received pay raises of 1.6% and 1.4%, in addition to increased pay for years of service credit, and any promotions. Civilian federal employees have received 0% increase for the past 3 years. Second, if you think I receive a "big fat federal government paycheck," then clearly you have never been a federal employee. The pay sucks. I would do much better in the private sector, but the work I'm doing helps people, so I enjoy it.
To begin with, everyone needs to understand that not all troops are "in harms way". In fact, most of them are not in harms way at all and won't be for most of their time in. Maybe they should rethink the military pay system to look more like the Corporate side where not everyone gets the same pay. Oh yeah, they do that already sort of. Those "in harms way" get combat zone bonuses. How about taking some of the perks away after retirement or for active duty. I was a Reservist for 14 years. We went to Iraq and did such a better job than the active duty unit that our presence was requested for a longer stay than the active or NG or other AR units were there for. We did get $1K per month bonus for being in the combat zone for 3 extra months on special assignment. However, upon coming home and going back to civilian world, we don't get medical for our family. We don't get local perks around town unless we retired...I still went there. I still served. And longer than many AD personnel. Many military spouses work. Are the spouses able to get medical so the soldier doesn't have to? In our two working person home, we decide who is picking up the benefits. Why can't their 2 person working home do the same? Lots of military are driving around expensive cars, have fancy clothing, etc. Not all, mind you, but it's a smaller scale of the real world civilians live. Our daughter is in the navy and the navy housing is overfull. So...she rents a house with others and has to cover the utilities,etc. Why not make it so they can all live in barracks with the limits of utilities instead of use, use, use to their hearts content? There are ways to cut back...as there are in the civilian world. It's just that ppl will always complain. We are going to complain ourselves into a deep recession and to the point where the volunteer force says screw it. Then we'll be back to the draft again and those who have decided not to volunteer might actually get called up to fill in some slots. How interesting that will be.
Well said! Thank you for also being a military wife and standing up for our guys. Being the wife of a soldier is so difficult, and them cutting pay makes the sacrifice made by the soldiers and the wives that much harder.
from one military spouse to another. well said! and to "Civilian" what our your work ours like? my husband spends the majority of the year under the ocean he might average 3 hours of sleep a day between work, standing watches and if he is lucky getting time to eat a meal. when in port he works on average 14-17 hour work days most weeks 7 days a week. do you work that much? do you get to sleep at night before you go to work the next day. do you get to eat your meals? or do you have to skip them because your on watch at the time and didn't have a relief so didn't get dinner and the kitchen i closed. have you ever been out to sea for months with no port call and start tuning out of food and our living off of corn flakes? shocking enough as it is.. that still happens a lot in this day in our military. i think our military deserves a lot more then what they get.
1% is not a raise when inflation is 3%.
Not sure where you're getting your data. There was an inflation surge in 2011, but the average for 2012 is 1.7%. So a 1% pay increase doesn't quite keep up, but it's better than most people are getting. The expectation of an above-inflation pay increase every year is unrealistic.
Cut the pay that congress receives before the men that protect their sorry lives. They are worried that their states will loose jobs from the budget cuts, SO THEY WANT TO CUT SOMEONES PAY THAT DESERVE IT.
Almost everyone is Congress is a millionaire, thanks to our system that requires people to effectively give up their careers to run for a major public office. Thus, your proposal really only hurts the few members of Congress that can actually relate to working people, and helps drive those few people from office.
Is panetta going to take a pay cut? How about if we start with congress, who started this mess originally, when we talk pay cuts? Your asking the military to take cuts, start with congress and then go after the people that actually do something for this country.
I have no problem limiting their raises to 1%. I work for Kentucky state government and haven't had a decent raise in over a decade. The last 4 years, I have had nothing but three 0% raises and a 2.3% pay cut. They have already written into law that future pay raises will be 0%. I have no idea how an organization can do that and still retain/hire new people, but that's the plan. So 1% sounds pretty darn fair right now.
Maybe to you, but you also don't put your life in harms way every day...you not receiving a pay raise is nowhere near on the same level as a soldier not receiving a raise. They're more deserving of a raise than any desk jockey's working for the government.
Your an Idiot!
I bet you sure work harder and provide a more useful service with the same risks in the KY State government offices than those whiney grunts.
I'm sorry, have you had to serve your country getting shot at or blown up and years away from your family? Poor guy, you're just stuck in Kentucky w/your family.
Also, I think it's hilarious that you're complaining about how your not getting paid enough. While your commenting on internet articles. On a work day. During work hours.
Yep, I'm sure you're out there earning your paycheck, better than those babies who cry about getting blown up and shot while getting paid what comes out to roughly minimum wage per hour.
So you telling me that the people who put their lives on the line each and every day, don't mean ish to the world. While the law makers can get all the money. Prior solider I am, that is why I am not in the military no more. No one higher up appreciates the sacrafice you give up. Famous people make more than our troops. CUT their pay? No what we need to is cut the people who making this laws and rules pay. Can't believe that this is the type of world that we are living in now. It just gonna get worse.
Well, that's what you get when the military votes republican. Your guys don't WANT to tax the rich...they'd rather cut your pay...
In reply to Bill and I quote, "let me assure you the military soldiers get paid a nice paycheck..." Well Bill as a sailor who served for 20 years this is NOT what I would have considered as a nice paycheck. After 20 years of service (and I was proud to serve), nearly 14 years of that time was spent away from my family. Now I will admit that when we are in hostile areas and we pay NO taxes our pay does increase significantly. But you need to keep in mind that when food, gas, utilities and everything else is going up 5, 10, 15 or more in the same time frame a 1% increase does nothing for the family.
So now let me get this straight, Congress is not willing to consider closing loopholes for millionares and billionaires but will consider cutting military pay (the ones who give mind, body and soul for this country). Cut WIC, Food Stamps and even unemployment benefits to the most needy, cut Medicare, Medicade and Social Security and kkep in mind Social Security and Medicaide are supplemented by the individuals who use it. But NOT ask those most capable to pony up. Tell the spouse back home of soldiers, sailors, airmen and marines that they get plenty of pay. WAKE UP PEOPLE!!!! They are coming after everything for them and now NOT even the 1% of this nation who bleed for her daily are safe, and your next.
You also forgot that they are on call 24/7.
I don't agree with military pay being cut or pay raises lowered. I mean for petesake we have other areas in the military that can use some cuts, which would allow our soldiers to keep their pay or allow their pay to be raised.
Go to hell Panetta. You're worthless.
Why not make the international bankers that the US government pimps them out to kick in on their salaries. It's the least they could do. And you could divy up the foreign aid they give to Israel too.
Why don't we just have all of Washington's elected officials take a pay cut and put a freeze on future raises until they start showing up for work and actually earning their money!!
RIGHT? My husband has been in 17 years and is about to deploy for the fourth time. Politicians do NOTHING. They should all get huge pay cuts.
Amen sister!
Why not just realign pay, by reducing top end pay and increasing the pay of the enlisted men. Just consider that the high end officers, of which there too many. Maximum pay, per MONTH, for Generals is:
Brigadier General (O-7) – $9,781.80
Major General (O-8) – $11,268.60
Lieutenant General (O-9) – $16,477.80
General (O-10) – $18,675.30
And then there's all the add-ons, including room and, subsistence as well as pampering.
Other Pay
Also a good idea! My husband has been in 17 years – he's an E7 (who has done the jobs of E8s and E9s)
So who do I write or call about this?
Is there another way? Probably. 435 congress members avg $175,000 annually = "cant even imagine"...100 senate members avg $175,000 -before benefits, i.e. retirement, medical, etc. +Can stay home in bad weather. Compare that to avg E5 military grade avg at $30,000 annually combat ready....whose benefits the officials we elected to take care of our vets want to cut... No question in my mind. Cut senate & congress annual salary by 20%...reduce retirement package...
Since congress didnt see fit to grant universal healthcare, how about making all congressmen pay for their health benefits?
They do pay for their health care, under the same system federal civilians use. I'm not defending them, just stating a fact.
These people put their lives on the line and Panetta wants to cut their pay????!!! Someone should cut his pay and the armchair warriors who sit in DC in their comfy offices. Is he out of his mind?????!!!!!
As a retired USN officer (who went up through the ranks), let me make a point: The troops in Afghanistan deserve every dollar they get - and more. But being in the service does not mean being in combat. The number of men and women who actually get to the zone of combat (e.g., anywhere in or near Afghanistan) is actually a small part of the active service force. The number who actually see combat is even smaller. The majority of service people are elsewhere, in the U.S. or other relatively safe locations. I would support a substantial increase in combat pay (doubling or tripling), smaller increases for sea pay, overseas pay, etc., and much smaller future increases for others.
How About Reducing the Numbers of all those NOT in Combat.
And then who would you propose support those in combat? There are a thousand things that have to happen "back home" to suport the people fighting the war. Take them away, and there won't be anyone fighting. Also, who do you think replaces those people that are fighting? Correct, the people that are currently "back home". It's not like WWII where you went over there for the duration and didn't come hom unless you were injured or dead.
I usually get lots of snide remarks when I make that same point. My husband has served 14 years in the AF so far. Yes, he made a choice to serve that others might not have, but honestly – he's no hero. He's never been deployed, never seen combat, and in his 14 years of service, only been required to PCS once, and TDY twice. Seriously – the local PD puts more on the line everyday than he ever has. He has free medical and dental, and a retirement worth 1/2 his pay, and college benefits waiting for him. PD/Firemen in our town have a retirement plan of roughly 25% of their salary, pay meidcal of $700+/month for family coverage. I read an article a few days ago with over 100+ comments complaining about how terrible our military is, because a retired colonel, who now pays $480 a YEAR for FAMILY medical coverage, would now pay closer to $3000 a year. Guess what everyone – $3000 a year is less than $300 a month – thats pretty incredible for family coverage for a retiree. It would be even cheaper than that for lower ranks.
Yes, some military make sacrifices. But, so do hometown heroes, who have a very similar salary, but no housing allowance, no education benefits, no free medical, etc...military deserves their combat pay, but in reality, gruntwork is gruntwork, and it doesn't take any sort of high-tech specialized skill to do a big chunk of military jobs – so people need to ground themselves in reality a little more before they let their emotions take hold.
Wow, way to throw your spouse under the bus. He'd probably be safer and get more support if he did go to war. Anyway, the high-tech specialized skill that most service members bring to the table is courage, plain and simple. They have the courage to do what needs to be done, to do what their country asks them to do, knowing the end result may be their death. I've never ever heard of a lawyer, banker, bartender, city council member, CEO, etc., being asked to do that. So, whether your spouse has or hasn't deployed, that option is still there and the time may come when he has to answer that call, and if he's any kind of USAF warrior, he'll proudly go and defend his country and your right to throw him under the bus.
Wait.. 14 years no deployment?! I'm sorry I find this hard to believe... I don't represent everyone in the military esp the AF but in my 13.5 years of the AF I've been deployed a good amount...
PSAB, UAE, Diego Garcia x3, Al Udied x3, Spain X2, Base X 2x, and multiple months at deployments to cover the holes in other states for periods of 2 or more months...
So you are telling me that your "Husband" hasn't deployed....... I just find that too hard to believe.. BUT with that being said.... I will say 1% pay raise is ok with me. We are in a recession.. but I will also acknowledge the gross overpayment of those in Washington!
4 years and close to $200,000 per year for life... THIS IS an OUTRAGE!!!
It is both Republicans and Democrats!!
Now for people saying " Military usually votes Republican" is full of it.. More Military voted for Obama then Romney.. look the numbers up...
But more Military Supported Ron Paul then Obama and Romney together when Ron Paul was running for the nomination.. and no he isn't technically a Republican.. he is a Libertarian.. spend Conservatively but live with as much personal liberty/responsibility as possible as well.
14 years in the military and no deployments and one PCS!!! Sounds like your husband is a rockstar. Your husband and a small group around him are the exception to the rule. Most of the guys I know (including myself) have 2 to 4 deployments before they hit 10 years. I'm Army, so those deployments are a year or longer. Please don't use your husband as the example because he is far and away from the picture that the rest of us have looked at.
I totally disagree. Even though some are not actually seeing action, they are behind the scenes doing major prep work and burning some serious "midnight oil." They too should be duly compensated. The reason why? Let a parachute not open. Who are they coming after? The person who may not be in a war zone who packed the chute. They work hard and are under pressure not to make mistakes because someone may lose their life because of it. You cannot trivialize their contributions to the war effort.
Nice job marginalizing military service. It's a good thing you're retired.
WHO CARES.............Obama don't ....so why should WE....as Obama once said back in 2009 ..."NO ONE FORCED THEM TO GO TO THE SERVICE."
That right then and there showed me THE PRESIDENT RESPECTED OUR TROOPS,OR LACK OF.
Obama IS A FAKE LEADER full of BULL-MANURE and nothing more.
HE DOES AS HE'S TOLD. HE IS A PUPPET. HE MERELY FOLLOWS ORDERS – JUST LIKE HIS PREDECESSORS, AND HIS EVENTUAL SUCCESSOR(S).
THE LAST ONE WHO TRIED TO.."CALL THE SHOTS"...WOUND UP DECORATING HIS WIFE'S BEST DRESS WITH HIS BRAINS.
COHERENT SENTENCES!! LEARN WHAT THOSE ARE!!
LEARN TO COMPREHEND. THAT HELPS. YOU'RE WELCOME.
Let's restart the draft and see who everyone feels about that. Speaking of which, how did Obama escape the draft years?
Obama legally registered with Selective Services. There was no draft in place when he was 18 years old, so he didn't escape anything.
Actually, he didn't.
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2011/jul/04/chain-email/barack-obama-said-troops-whine-and-nobody-made-the/
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2011/jul/04/chain-email/barack-obama-said-troops-whine-and-nobody-made-the/
make a fair critique next time
He actually never said that or anything of the sort. You will not be able to find one credible source of that "quote". For the record, the chain email that your cousin, Bob, sent you is not a credible source. But thanks for your insightful input into the conversation.
Spent 21+ years in uniform; this is not the first time the military has been screwed, nor will it be the last. Heck, even now, all of hte "promises" made to solders over the years are being destroyed. Here's a thought, I want congress to get the same damn pay increase as the military!
I agree, but welcome to public service.
aren't those in Congress public servants?
No, no and no. just because I do not agree with how they are used on the globe does not mean I do not care about them as people. you have to be kidding after what you have put them through to cut their pay? cut congresses pay, cut the presidents stipend for life. Cut the pay of any CEO that INC.s in the US of A. – but these guys? someone has lost their sense of reality big time.
Thank you for supporting us!
As a former U.S. Army soldier, let me assure you the military soldiers get paid a nice paycheck...Remember all he is recommending is a 1% increase on pay and nothing more...Remember married soldiers also receive BAS and BHA, BAS is a monthly payment to help cover the cost of groceries and BHA is a monthly payment to help cover the cost of rent...Trust me they are doing fine and this is coming from a former soldier who served, honorably, for almost 8 years.....
THANK YOU!
For speaking the truth and of course, for your service.
As a 22-yr military member, I can assure you these soldiers and airmen deserve more than they receive. They do not work a normal 8-hour day, 5 days a week work schedule as their normal civilian counterparts enjoy. The BAH/BAS argument does not hold water. So if I'm reading you correctly, the single soldier (who doesn't get BAH/BAS) doesn't count? How about we cut the pay to our Congressmen and women? Let them "lead by example".
Single soldiers get free housing and food. They're being very well compensated, considering that housing and food typically consume 30-40% of an individual's income.
Shout your rat infested mouth. What do you know about a family of three, four, or five.
Bill, thank you for your service to our country and utilizing your 1st Amendment right to free speach that you served to protect for 8 years. I must disagree with you however. I am a soldier serving on Active Duty in the U.S. Army going on 6 years of service. I have been deployed for a third of that time and I am currently deployed as we speak. Here is a little bit of info for you: January 1, 2013 the military received a 1.7% pay increase. What also occurred was a increase from 4.2% to 6% in Social Security taxes (a tax that I will probably never see in my old age by the way, however that is an argument for a different time). I LOST $18 per paycheck as a result of this. Not to mention, add in the cost of fuel and food that has skyrocketed under this administration/congress and my "nice paycheck" that you seem to think we receive disappears more and more under this government. Tack on the $50 billion stripped out of the defense budget as well as the 1/2 a TRILLION that will impact us over the next 10 years due to this sequestration....it's not exactly the best time to be serving in the military. The military, under this administration, has been nothing but a target and it will continue to be this way. China and Russia aren't decreasing funding to their military, the are RAMPING it up........
First of all, BAS and BAH does not cover all expenses. BAS is only less than 7 dollars a day which roughly equals out to 210.00 a month, hate to tell you but speaking with a family of four, that doesnt pay for half the goceries. BAH differs according to where you live, and trust me the BAH only covers a portion of rent. After you pay bills, the rest of the rent, and rest of the goceries, the military service members barely have any money left for gas and the bare essentials. I guarantee you that if they start cutting military pay, there will be less people enlisting which would hurt the country's military readiness
Regardless of what it covers, it's still tax free money that should be counted as part of their overall compensation. I know many civilians who would be thrilled to receive tax free allowances that help cover housing and food.
Well there is civilians who eat better and live off tax payers money...PRISONERS is one of the people. No again as a veteran, how is that fair? You talking about the people who are protecting the world and you got entertainers, athletes, CEO making more. Yall can say what you want to. Soliders, Police, Teachers, Fire Fighters are ALL UNDERPAID
@Jim Then tell those civilians that want the tax free compensation to do what every military member has done, enlist!
No one I know begrudges the military their BAS and BAH. I'm just pointing out that it's a pretty sweet deal, and part of their total compensation. I know folks who haven't received pay raises in years, I know folks who have had to take pay cuts or reduced hours due the the economic climate. We don't have those problems in the military, so it seems a bit out of place in my opinion for people to complain about the military's compensation.
@Jim – I served for 20 years, and loved almost every second of it. Deployed several times as I'm sure you did. I'm not saying the military compensation is bad, it's just that if we let it start lagging behind the economy, it will get bad. It's an all volunteer force. We want young men and women to join. However, if the pay is current with today's economy, the military will degrade, maybe not in numbers, but in quality of young men and women who join. In today's world, we need a stronger military, not a weaker one. If anyone missed the video clip the other day, N Korea posted a state made video of New York burning after a nuclear strike. We need to keep people like this at bay with a strong military.
Bill speaks the the truth. Additionally, the BAS and BAH allowances are non-taxed. Our troops are well compensated. I served for 7 years, I know. Factor in 30 days of paid vacation per year, free medical and dental, and a rock solid retirement plan....and it's kind of hard to get outraged about them getting short changed because they're only receiving a 1% pay raise.
@Jim, Not sure where you "served", but given the number of deployments most soldiers endure in today's environment, including the training lead up, you are way off base with your pretend assessment of how well they get paid. Given the 2013 military base pay chart, the majority of enlisted live at or just above the poverty line (before housing and cost of living pay, if they receive it, which some do not given location and barracks availability). They would likely get paid more if they were garbage men or toll booth collectors, but they have chosen to risk their lives defending this country. Not to mention this pay "raise" simply keeps pace with inflation in most cases, so it's not a raise, as much as it is a non-cut in pay. Sadly, people like you have forgotten the brothers they fought alongside and can justify this shame. The idea that we can completely bypass all the real cuts that need to be made, the culture of waste that exists in the military and the Leon Panetta's who jet set back and forth to CA at $1 million a year in cost, are the first things that should be on the chopping block, long before the word soldier pay cut even enters our thoughts. This is not even covering the billions we send overseas to Muslim radical governments like Egypt, who these poor soldiers will probably have to fight against in 5-10 years. We send 27 million a year to teach Moroccans how to make pottery, but we can’t pay our own soldiers for a decade or more of fighting the wars our population forgets while watching Honey Boo Boos.
Really Jim? "rock solid retirement"? I guess, but only if you complete 20+ years of service. Get out at 10, 15 years and what do you get? Zero! Unlike civilian life, where you are still likely to get something after only a few years of service with them. Now as to the 30 days of vacation per year? That sounds generous, until you find out that this is 30 calendar days, not 30 weekdays. If a service member wanted to take off, starting after the end of their duty day on Friday, through the weekend (Sat, Sun), the next "work week" (Mon thru Fri) and the following weekend, reporting back to work on the next Monday, that would be 9 days of leave! (or possibly even 10, depending on if they make you sign out on the first Friday, costing you that day also) Point me to any civilian job that would cost you as much in leave time for the same length.
Sure. Some civilians do get a tax free stipened for food and housing. It's called welfare, and we all pay for that too.
@Jim, you think I am being disingenuous and then suggesting that the benefits you mention (that not all soldiers receive) are worth double the pay when compared to someone doing a less essential function? Check your facts instead of posting on here and pretending to have served and supporting this nonsense. Many garbage men and toll booth collectors get similar benefits, and their base pay is higher. 30 days paid vacation versus one month spent in JRTC (8 weekend days gone) nets me about 22 days, plus soldiers must use leave on weekend days that they otherwise would not be working. Add some other training in there to eat up a few more weekends and that 30 days is soon less than the standard private company offers, and far less than other government leeches. Take one deployment (1 year) and you lose 96 days of “vacation time” to spending your weekends in a combat zone. If you did wear a uniform, you were likely Coast Guard, doing bikini inspections in Key West. You should be ashamed of yourself.
@Bill, Not sure where you "served", but given the number of deployments most soldiers endure in today's environment, including the training lead up, you are way off base with your pretend assessment of how well they get paid. Given the 2013 military base pay chart, the majority of enlisted live at or just above the poverty line (before housing and cost of living pay, if they receive it, which some do not given location and barracks availability). They would likely get paid more if they were garbage men or toll booth collectors, but they have chosen to risk their lives defending this country. Not to mention this pay "raise" simply keeps pace with inflation in most cases, so it's not a raise, as much as it is a non-cut in pay. Sadly, people like you have forgotten the brothers they fought alongside and can justify this shame. The idea that we can completely bypass all the real cuts that need to be made, the culture of waste that exists in the military and the Leon Panetta's who jet set back and forth to CA at $1 million a year in cost, are the first things that should be on the chopping block, long before the word soldier pay cut even enters our thoughts. This is not even covering the billions we send overseas to Muslim radical governments like Egypt, who these poor soldiers will probably have to fight against in 5-10 years. We send 27 million a year to teach Moroccans how to make pottery, but we can’t pay our own soldiers for a decade or more of fighting the wars our population forgets while watching Honey Boo Boos.
I'm not sure where you live, but garbage men and toll collectors don't get free health and dental, 30 days of paid vacation each year, subsidized housing and food, and clothing allowances in my town. As they shouldn't. However, military folks do, and these things need to be counted as part of their total compensation package. Looking at the base pay charts alone is disingenious. Additionally, with the deployments come hazardous duty pay, hostile fire pay, family separation pay, and tax-free combat zone exclusions...and you keep your BAH on top of it.
first i want to say thank you for serving. secondly.. not sure about other branches or how long ago you served. But being married for 11 years to my husband in the navy and we do not get money for grocery's LOL! we do get money when my husband can not eat on the boat because the mess is closed do to maintenance reason. but that is the only time. Though all branches do get BAH. if you live in military housing you do not see that BAH. which would be fine since that is suppose to pay for all the stuff you would pay out in town but, now they are slowly making the move for military members in housing to pay their own utility's. wouldn't be a big deal if we were keeping some of the bah but we are not. there are extra pays involved, like sea pay and so on. but soon as you leave the boat and head to your shore duty rotation your paycheck cuts almost in half. I'm sure there will be more families struggling that are not getting any extra combat pays and sea pays then the ones that are. or there will be families like ours that choose to do 3 sea tours in a row to keep the pay that is needed in a state like we live in where the cost of living is way more then the military gives. with all that said.. at this point with the things going on.. i will happily take what ever raise we get LOL! better then being told again we aren't going to get a paycheck at all 🙂
If the pay is so great and worth the sacrifice, why did you quit after 8 years service.....?
If you do a little research, you'll see that pay isn't the first or even second most important criteria for most workers, and that includes the military. Pay is only one small part of total job satisfaction, and anyone who makes an employment decision based solely on compensation isn't looking at the big picture.
BAH doesn't cover all housing expenses, genius. Most BAH levels don't even match the geographic location where they are assigned and military folks often have to live in squallor. Thanks for playing.
What he says is true. I live in a town full of military and quite a few on my street alone have dual income couples in the military. They have their mortgage paid for by some sort of military credit due to married couples in the military. Therefore, between the two of them their salaries they make six figures and have two brand new Escalades in the driveway. When I goto the Mercedes dealership I ALWAYS see military in their fatigues getting their Benzes serviced. They get paid way too much IMO. In regards to them fighting for our "freedom" i don't believe that for a second. They are fighting for our IMPERIALISM.
BAS is NOT given to all soldiers married or un married. It is provided when there is no military mess hall/cafeteria in the area. It is not provided even with a family if you have a mess hall on your installation period. That is law. the only thing you get is a slight increase in your housing for being married. However if you are living where housing is available you get nothing and are forced to live in base housing.
We don't take care of them when they come home. Why should we take care of them while they're still killing and dying for us? Really, is anyone surprised? The US Government is absolutely nauseating to me anymore. Truly sick. It's nop wonder we're a global laughing stock.
You are failing to realize they are trying to keep as many jobs intact as they can. If they wanted to make a cut they could simple reduce their numbers, by say 25%. Instead he is trying to come up with a plan to keep everyone employeed.
umm, they have been making cuts on people. lots of them. tons of men just got removed from the military for no other reason then the job the do is over manned. no other reasoning then that. "thanks for the amazing job you have done, here is a check get out. i don't care if you want to stay in we have too many people in your job field"
I feel we should start the pay cuts with the politicians who do nothing but sit around all day. They are quick to send our troops to fight a war that we shouldn’t be fighting in the first place. We have lost so many good men and women…….. Hero’s!!!!! I feel if these politicians want to keep their pay than they should have to fight this war and let our troops come home. Even the civilian contractors get paid 2-3 times if not more than the troops get paid. Some troops even get food stamps because they do not make what people think they make. Let’s start our cuts by cutting what politicians get paid!!!!!!
This is an intellectually dishonest and outrageously irresponsible headline. This is not a pay CUT. This is a pay FREEZE. The same freeze that civilian federal employees (including those working for the military) have had for the last several years. There is a huge difference. Stop trying to make this into something that it isn't.
you are good and they are quick – they changed the headline.
@Irresponsible – Actually it is considered a pay cut due to the fact that the cost of everything goes up, the military pay rate will not rise as fast as the index. Essentially, they will not be able to keep up with the price of groceries, gas, ect. Military life is stressful enough without having to stretch their paycheck even further.
If you go back and re-read the article it CLEARLY states, and I quote "effectively decreasing troop salaries next year". If you do not know what the meaning of decrease is I would have to say that the words: abatement, compression, condensation, constriction, contraction, cutback, decline, declining, decrescence, depression, diminution, discount, downturn, dwindling, ebb, falling off, loss, reduction, shrinkage, striction, subsidence, waning ALL COME TO MIND! Oh yea and the word CUT could be used to describe decrease. We are amoung a bunch of geniuses here that think "decrease" doesnt mean to "cut". Think about it.
Well that escalated quickly.
I take your point – though it would have been just as easy a point to make without trying to insult me. I know what decrease means. I also know a good deal about the nuts and bolts of how this is supposed to go, and the headline that was previously posted on the front page (and still exists here) was/is intellectually dishonest. If it wasn't intellectually dishonest or misleading, it would not have been changed on the front page.
The point I was trying to make that is that the headline (which as I said has been changed) clearly made it out to be a cut in salary. You insult me, but the public at large sees a headline that says "Panetta to recommend pay cut for military" – they don't think about offsets, tax increases, or inflation. They think about cuts in base salary. It's not about the 2nd and 3rd order effects of inflation and taxes. It's not about "effectively decreasing take home pay" – which, because I can do math (I know, hard for someone that is such a "genius"), I know that a decrease in an annual increase and an increase in inflation and taxes would do. I got it.
It's .7% of an increase that hasn't even happened yet. And where is the outrage about everyone else that isn't getting any increases, effectively decreasing their pay while everything goes up? Everyone is getting hosed. And I'm not going to get into the argument about "deserve" – subjective and irrelevant to the post.
I do think the days of fairly indiscriminate 4.7% increases (or similar) year after year are over – it just is what it is. But for what it's worth, I don't think the .7% in 1.7% is worth going after. For what it's worth, there are ways to deal with the budget without messing around with pay and personnel as much (or at all, actually).
OH NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
OUR GLORIOUS HEROES WILL STARVE. THEY WILL BE FORCED TO EAT THOSE WHOM THEY HAVE SO MAGNIFICENTLY SLAUGHTERED IN THE NAME OF FREEDOM AND SUPERBOWL. I WONDER WHAT INNOCENT CIVILLIANS AND CHILDREN TASTE LIKE.
Good posting, WAKE UP AMERICA! I couldn't have said it better!
Meat is meat. Who cares?
Oooh, look how edgy you are. Using a 'K' instead of a 'C'. Your clever disregard for the military, and mock concern for their well being. Oh well done, sirrah. I dare say you are even more droll in person. You win the internet, my good man.
THANK YOU, JEFF. YOU ARE A GOOD MAN. GAWD BLESS.
KKKKKKKKKKK......KAPS lock is on. Wake up .
SCREAMING IS CATHARTIC.
How about a pay cut for the TOP people at the pentagon!!!!! Moron!!!!! Hahahahahhah
Good idea, Hahahahahaha. The problem here is, is that those right-wing thugs, including Barack Obama, on top won't hear of it!
Now is that legislation I would definitely vote for!
You have it wrong, YOU don't vote on their pay ..THEY do.
After all ...Its much easier to get a pay increase when you give it to yourself. and isn't that what being a politician is all about? Making your own rules, setting your own pay, just being more awesome and better than everyone else in general?
yep
Amen to that, pay cuts for these idiots sitting safely on American soil instead of the kids they're sending to die in foreign nations to interfere.
Are you kidding me? Cut their own pay, or even worse, reduce the numbers of multi-million dollar equipment that is needed less and less as we move to a completely different types of warfare? But the contractors might suffer! Wahhhh!