By Jennifer Rizzo
Pfc. Bradley Manning, the U.S. Army soldier accused in the biggest leak of intelligence documents in the military's history, was formally charged Thursday.
Aiding the enemy is a capital offense, but prosecutors are not seeking the death penalty. If convicted on all the charges, Manning will likely face life in prison. The 24-year-old is suspected of giving hundreds of thousands of secret documents to the WikiLeaks website.He was arraigned Thursday at Fort Meade, Maryland, before military judge Col. Denise Lind, marking the beginning of the court-martial process.
Manning, who sat in his dress uniform with his hands clasped throughout the arraignment, deferred pleading guilty or not guilty to the charges until a later date. He can enter a plea any time before the start of the trial.
The charges against him include aiding the enemy, wrongfully causing intelligence to be published on the Internet, transmitting national defense information and theft of public property or records.
Manning's counsel also deferred choosing how the case will be tried. In a military court-martial, there are three options from which the defendant can choose - trial by a military judge, trial by a panel of senior officers or trial by a panel that includes one-third of enlisted noncommissioned officers.
Holding off on entering a plea and choosing a forum for the trial could be part of the defense's overall strategy, according to Capt. John Haberland, a legal spokesman for U.S. Army Military District of Washington.
The defense could be waiting to see the outcome of various motions, Haberland said.
Motions were submitted at the arraignment, mostly dealing with information gathering for the defense, Haberland said. A hearing is set for March 15 and 16, where it is expected the defense and prosecution will be able to argue their motions.
A trial start date has not been set. The prosecution asked for the trial to begin August 3, but the defense would like the trial to begin no later than June.
If the prosecution gets its way, Manning would be in "pretrial confinement for over 800 days before the trial begins," said Manning's civilian attorney, David Coombs, arguing for a speedy trail.
The defense also asked that the prosecution provide more specifics on what evidence or statements it intends to introduce at trial.
Coombs posed a serious of questions to the overseeing military judge at the start of Thursday's proceedings.
In what seemed like an effort to assess any potential bias, Coombs asked Lind what she had known of the Manning case before the arraignment.
"I knew there was a case," Lind replied.
When asked if she had formed any opinion about the case or the alleged leaks, Lind responded with a short "No."
WikiLeaks, the international online group that publishes secret government documents it receives from outside sources, set off a firestorm a year and a half ago when it made public U.S. diplomatic cables and other sensitive documents, most of them pertaining to the Iraq and Afghanistan wars.
The disclosure of hundreds of the documents continues to cast a shadow over the U.S. intelligence community.
© 2012 Cable News Network. Turner Broadcasting System, Inc. All Rights Reserved.
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Whitney's crack pipe.
Manning betrayed the Army's most highest and most trusted corps. The MI corps is for the dedicated patriots, trusted with information to protect the nation and its soldiers. For all of the patriot intelligence professionals who have suddenly found roadblocks to information necessary to help their units, for the soldiers who have been injured or killed because intelligence had to funnel through new security procedures, all because this punk couldn't man up to being a soldier, I hope Manning gets life in prison and suffers many shiv wounds and rapes during his life in prison. I can't believe he isn't being tried as traitor to America.
Manning was out on a patrol where the Army was busting up a Sunni political rally where they were passing out leaflets.Manning had his interpreter translate the leaflet which asked the question, what Malaki the Iraqi President, had done with a lot of missing money. When the Army officers found out what it said they just rounded them up faster in direct violation of their human rights.
Manning saw the cruel stupidity of America's War of Terror up close and I hope he get's the Peace Prize for possibly saving Millions of Human lives by speeding an end to this stupid war that is draining America's economy and reputation.
I think this troll "F B M" may just hold the record for the number of consecutive comments without a response to his...14 on this page alone...pathetic, but hilarious none the less...
Hey, I'll bet "American Teenager" could give me a run for my welfare check.
Like it or not, he broke the UCMJ. Whether or not what he did can be justified in our minds is beside the point; did he break the rules? Did he break his oath? Did he commit an act that went against his commitment to the United States Military? I am not going to try and justify what he did, nor am I going to speak to whether or not it was a "just" thing to do. He broke his oath, he commited an act that was in direct opposition with what he pledged to do, which was serve the United States. It's a damn shame, because he really seems like a bright and intelligent young man, and he is probably going to spend a very long time, if not the rest of his life, in prison.
Thank you Scott. Couldn't have said it better.
", (NAME), do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice."
Guess it depends on which part of his oath he felt was most important. He followed his conscience. History will sort out the consequences of his actions.
Let this poor guy go. He's a Hero, exposing all the dirty secrets the dirty government try to hide. My tax dollars help fund this war I have a right to know what my government is doing. No one was hurt as a result of all this actually bland leaking. Cowboy soldiers over there killing for thrill and get a slap on the wrist.
Wow, lots of people in here feeling strong about this. I wonder how many of you have military service under your belt and those of you who do how much and what kind. Bottom line is this kid is anything but a hero, he is technically a traitor and should be treated as such. Those of you saying the American people have a right to know are wrong. If you want to know then walk down to your local recruiting depot and enlist. That's the problem with people today; lots of opinions based on nothing except what the media feeds you. Grow up and if you are uninformed than stay out of the threatening posts business.
And you're not eating the same media bullshit?
Regardless of whether or not you feel like other soldiers are getting away with murder, it doesn't change the fact that Bradley Manning took an oath, and he broke that oath. The case cannot be about personal feelings about what he did, he broke the rules bottom line. We can feel like what he did was the right thing, and maybe it was morally, but legally? No, it wasn't. It was wrong. He broke the rules, and he will be punished for that.
I feel sorry for you linda Collins, You have absolutely no idea what the information he gave out did. He was trained all about how information can save or cost lives.
Despite that, he handed over information that exposed whole families that helped our soldiers. He exposed aid workers. Those soldiers in contact with them were also endangered. Despite is a good word for it, because it was spite that motivated Manning. He really did not care if it killed someone.
He better ask for a military judge. The officers will give him a harder sentence because they are responsible for the safety of the men/women they command & they take that duty personally. The enlisted non commissioned officers will also give him a harder sentence because they also are responsible for the safety of those under them & they will see it as a personal betrayal of their fellow soldiers, who have parents, spouses, & children depending on them. I lived the military lifestyle. He betrayed us all. I hope he enjoyed his 5 minutes of fame. It is time to pay for it.
This guy hasnt fried yet?? Wow, in wartime aiding the enemy is 99% death penalty usually. Luckily for this traitor he has the most far left leaning administration in US history to save him. Anya, shut up please. Your biasm towards this matter is clearly evident.
And yours isn't?
Apparently Manning did have his WWJD wristband on.
Bradley Manning should be hanged for his crimes against our country.
Before or after Bush & Cheney?
I totally agree with you.
I agree...this is treason by any definition. Maybe his sexual orientation will help in his case, huh?
Whatever his sexual orientation; it did not make him become a traitor, nor did it prevent him from becoming a traitor. His spite & malice does have bearing on the case instead. As will his knowledge of the dangers of releasing such information & his knowledge of the penalties for releasing secure information. I know fine people of every orientation & there are awful people in every orientation too. The military sentences more upon the facts of a case. It is hard to play tear jerker games when they only have to determine if he violated the military code, yes or no. His lawyer is in for a rude awakening if he thinks to play grandstanding civilian court games with a military courts marshal.
Like letting the court wait for the defense by not specifying the chosen form or the plea...That is why the court had to name August as a date. They might need more time to assemble a particular form of trial since the defense is dawdling. They would need to assemble a sufficient number of officers or non commissioned officers.
The lawyer is also just being an idiot annoying that judge. It does not bring outside pressure on the court & they might need that judge for trial by judge of this case. Quite frankly, Trial by judge might be to his best advantage. Officers & non commissioned officers are unlikely to view this case in a better light than the judge will.
An officer of the line has a rigid code of conduct & honor drilled into him by the military academy. The death before dishonor kind. Plus they have a duty to their command however large it is. They will see Manning as someone who attempted to do damage to fighting units. Their empathy would go to those fighting units.
Manning might try his luck with non commissioned officers, thinking that they are closest to his own previous rank. The problem is non commissioned officers have been in the service long enough to be contemptuous of a misfit who tries to get revenge upon other soldiers. They work beside soldiers just like the ones Manning wanted to harm every day. They will view his actions as a personal betrayal. Again, there will be no empathy for Manning with them.
Yep, Manning is between a rock & a hard place if his lawyer keeps annoying that judge. It will do nothing to affect the fairness of his trial. The military will give him a fair trial under the military code of justice. The only thing it will affect is Manning's sentencing if there is any judicial choice available.
All you idiots claiming support for this turd should walk into your local marine base bar and spout off the way you are here.
You of course won't do that because you are as spineless as this traitor.
Absolutely!! If ppl could see the other side of things, they would understand exactly why he is a traitor! Serve 9 years in military intel and then I'll listen to what these ppl have to say. I keep hearing whining that the American ppl have a right to know...no they do not! If you want to have the privilege of knowing, get yourself a clearance! So once I again I say, Bradley Manning is a traitor!!
Are you truly that fucking stupid that you can't even spell 'people'?
Marine bar? I went to work a said this man was a hero. you clearly havent been anywhere or have been deep in it enough to see the war crimes comitted. or are just as guilty as those pilots.
KILL!!!
this is when you yell back...BABIES...
And you clearly have never booted up and seen any action further than your computer keyboard.
Do not speak for me. He is no hero to myself or my brothers, in or out of a jar bar. And lose the make believe handle you use. You are not nor will you ever be associated with the USMC. Keep dreaming!
USMC is spelled with capital letters troll.
Babies, oh yeah, the ones in the families helping our soldiers that Manning outed...The ones that disappeared after being dragged out in the night by the insurgents that were trying to kill our soldiers. There were reports of finding their disordered possessions abandoned..... The people are probably in shallow graves. You do know insurgents like to torture or kill the babies in front of the parents for helping the soldiers, right. You also know they are too poor to abandon the few possessions they have, right. If even one of them died, Manning has their blood on his hands.
yanks don't like it when their war crimes are exposed, do they?? They'd prefer to piss on others.
i pity the marines. if only they could live out their homo-eroticism freely. if only they had better choices offered to them. it must be frustrating to see the more neurally-endowed doing things with their brains. it must be like magic when Manning found the will to do what's right. and the dumb ape always hates'wizardry'. it's a good thing suicide is on the rise in the military
gotta weed them bad genes out!
Unfortunately, it's the 'good ones' who are offing themselves.
Elijah – man with no pride who does not even spell his name with capital letter. He is also a man with no sense of honor, pride, and the concept of service to one's own country. The epitome of a generations who had it too good and were thought that everybody is a winner.
Well Elijah I got a news for you. In life not everybody is a winner. There are many losers like you with hedonistic attitudes and feeling of injustice because they could not make it. Using terms like "neurally-endowed" does not make you look smart. In reality it reveals you to be a nabob and a smart ass. If you were so intelligent as you think you are, you would know that one has to tailor one's diatribe to the audience level. Your aloof attitude would dictate that you talk in slang that we the Cro-Magnon active and former service members understand since you have such a disdain for us.
Now go and Google the terms I used so you can learn them and use those terms in your ranting and ravings on the interwebs trying to boost your fragile ego and impress other losers like you.
Boris Kain
18D
Well said haloguy628. elijah & EBM(must mean excessive bowel movement) are obviously borrowing their parents computers to spew insults at the grown ups in a fit of infantile pique. They do not understand what is really outside this country, nor what they are protected from. Nor the price of that protection. The soldiers, sailors, airmen,coast guard, & marines with their families.....We all know the cost up close. We are ashamed of a soldier who betrays his brothers & sisters in service along with our country.
A lot of these posts are going to get flagged just for the obscene language. Do they really think military people haven't heard curses before(snicker,snicker).....It makes me smile, if they think they are going to shock us.
I even know how to read lips for curses; from the time one ship's Captain swore a blue streak because the bomb disposal crew couldn't let him move his vehicle. It was close to where they were checking a torpedo on the dock... to see if it was armed. We were watching through binoculars from the division office on an aircraft carrier nearby. Brand new candy apple red sports car. He was practically frothing at the mouth, & he had a vast knowledge of colorful language that we just had to admire.
If these dweebs think they will punish us with their sophomoric obscenity...we can flag them faster than they can type.
All you fucking jar-head wannabes can suck my traitorous cock.
It's obvious you do not have a cock.
It fell off after I butt-fucked your dad.
Good come back F M B. Your Intellect is far superior to anyones on this thread. All hail the idiot F M B.
Thanks, Praetorian. That means a lot to me, coming from you.
Hail Caesar!
No problem, any time you want to be called a idiot just let me know.
It is clear your initials stand for EXCESS BOWEL MOVEMENT, suits you to a T.
I am sure we can locate a magnifying lens & a pair of tweezers for you to play with that dangly bit of yourself. Add an eyedropper to that equipment & you can service yourself!
People likely died because of his actions. If he is guilty then he should be the poster boy for people who think about such things in the future. I'm just guessing but I would expect that he cost us some very serious money as well. I've heard he ws upset about being passed over for promotion? Is that true? If so it appears his managers had a very good sense of Judgement. Maybe they should have changed his job?
I do not condone violating military law but, having said that, there appears to be no wiggle room under Military Law to first determine if, in fact, that what Manning did was treasonous and the damge he caused must be clearly proven.
I served in the USAF and have seen in the past how unfair a Military Court Marshal can be. I only hope that in due course that the Military can, without doubt, can prove its case.
My last comment is a question. If our government and/or Military can make decisions in a cloak of secrecy that contradict our Civil/Military Rules of Law, then who is more guilty. Hopefully, our elected/military officials have not moved us as a nation to a level of Machiavellianism?
Oh, I'm sure more people died from the 'actions' of Obama and his mongoloid predecessor.
There is no wiggle room at all. The evidence that he uploaded the data is solid. The damage is harder to count, because whole families were reported missing after being dragged out of bed in the night by insurgents. We can only hope they didn't suffer too long, People that poor do not abandon everything they need to live. Those people, & the aid workers he also outed with names & locations who had to flee or be protected, were not the only ones affected. The soldiers who were in contact with them were endangered too. I have no doubt there is blood on Manning's hands. The information that left Manning went to the insurgents. He planned that it would be public & bragged about doing it. Sick twisted creep.
I like how this article doesn't mention that Manning has been NOMINATED FOR THE NOBEL PEACE PRIZE. He's a hero.
There was a time when winning, or eve being nominate for the Nobel Peace Prize meant something important. Now, after Yasir Arafat won it for being an arch-terrorist and mass murderer, and Barack Obama won it for doing nothing whatever, it ain't what it was cracked up to be. Manning's lawyers won't mention it in trial.
You misunderstood. Manning was nominated to have Mr. Nobel's invention stuck where the sun don't shine and detonated. Then all of you worshipers can have a piece of him.
Nominating him is an ugly joke. If they carry through with it, they will lose a lot of respect.
From who? Some fuck-tard in Jersey?
Ancestry.
I think Mr. Assange has his mind on a bit of illicit manipulation and coercion of some from a particular heritage to overempower or intimidate for the purpose of defamation.
Soldier Manning attended schools in Wales, England.
Mr. Assange hails from Australia.
Well, at least they received an education. Which is far more than can be said about most of the people in this country.
why you such a little bitch someone pick on you when you were little kid mommy not hug you enough daddy not take you fishing?
Had a great childhood. Even learned how to spell and use punctuation.
why do you come off as such a little bitch? only child, people just do not understand you do they? you sound fine now, must have been to bed. now that you are not tweeking, get some sleep and put down the pipe tweeker.
Some people are born without proper feelings, toohip, Sociopathic is the term. Unfortunately both FBM & Manning seem unable to project beyond themselves & have feelings for the people harmed by his act. In Manning's case it is even more egregious, because his training included knowledge that serious consequences to people could occur after releasing secure information. Pitiful creatures toohip. I feel sorry for their parents.
Hi, toohip. How was last nights cock-fest? Did you get to swallow enough of your step-dad's jizz?
And as for you, Really Jersey; why don't you go back to feltching The Situations tainted seed out of Snooki's bleeding asshole.
There's a good reason why all the toxic waste gets dumped in Jersey.
Careful, Washington.
You really have very little wiggle room to talk, here.
http://michaelfury.wordpress.com/2011/03/04/enemies-list/
Bye!
This is very sad, but what was he thinking? The military kills people. That's what they do. If he had a problem with it, he should not have enlisted. There are rules and they have to be followed. The actual damage that he did needs to be considered plus there has to be a deterring effect. You folks making sex related comments need to restrain yourselves
this traitous turd should be summarily put to death and dumped out to sea where prevailing currents steer his traitorous carcass away from America. To think this traitorous pos even drapes the uniform of my country around his pathetic turd ball self makes me wanna puke..the uniform I served in for 22 years. may his little turd ball self be put to death and suffer in hell.
ogre12 – That is the best way to put it I have ever read. Thank you.
The world would be a better place if everyone that thought like you would die.
After he's acquitted, I hope he moves in next door to you. Providing of course that there's a vacancy in your trailer park.
Ogre12,
But how to you REALLY feel? Your post is kinda wishy washy. LoL
That is the best laugh I have had yet! The juxtaposition of ogre12's masterful summation of military attitude towards a betraying slimeball vs EBM with his pathetic, hopeless, wish upon a star for his dreams to come true...Someday my prince will come...Fairy dust is all you need to fly...First star to the left & straight on til mornin (Bwah ha ha ha ha ha).
Sorry ogre, for my flight of fancy. Damn, you can really tell my kids watched a lot of movies huh? Stuff gets into your head & sticks there. Plus, now I have granddaughters. I am doomed to this carp. I need a drink.
He should get life in prison with no chance of parole same as other traitors who have sold out their country. Releasing classified and sensitive information is still considered treason. He leaked info that probably caused the deaths of people in covert operations in some very sensitive areas of the world. And for a US soldier who took an oath to protect and defend his country to do this, it is treason plain and simple. This guy is no hero for free speech. His is a traitor that caused the deaths of people who were putting their lives on the line for America. He should never again see the light of day.
He should get a medal for revealing some of the crimes of the Government.
Blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah...blow me.
Extremely well put, Manny. I agree. Manning deserves to be jailed & forgotten in shame.
he deserves to die. he is the enemy of the state.
Whoever says this guy is a hero should join his @ss next to the firing squad. Government lies exposed? That is you argument. Saying such things shows how ignorant and clueless you are to your cozy life and what it takes to keep a country safe and secure. You take everything you have in this country for granted. There is at evil in every corner of the world that is trying to kill you every minute of the day, 365 days a year. And you need to kill evil with evil. This traitor gave the evil a helping hand. It so sad to see so many defending this guy, because it shows how dumbed down and clues people in this country are becoming. Sleep walking sheep. He needs to be made an example of. So many state secrets are leaked from every corner of the government because there are little consequences to fear.
You two should hook up and feltch your aids infested jizz out of each others bleeding, all 'Mare-can assholes.
I prefer that he rot in obscurity. There is no cachet to protesting life in prison for all the cheerleaders like EBM. He can faithfully bring him cookies, as they both fade out.
Long live free information, hope this guy gets out and does it again
are you also acoward
And put more lives in jeopardy
what have you done for your country lately awhole? no need to answer because i already know the answer..NOTHING. worthless little worms like you are like that..suck up air that should be reserved for REAL people.
What exactly have YOU done for your country, numb-nuts?
It looks like that Extra Bowel Movement(EBM) cleaned out the small amount of wits you had. His previous post said he already did more than his part for our country. More than a Extra Bowel Movement like you or Manning will EVER do in 2 lifetimes. He served us for TWENTY TWO YEARS as a service member, bless him. You really need to practice focusing bowels. The key is retention.
Really Jersey will believe any asshole who spews nonsense about 'having served'.
your and ID IO T
Myopic moron.
So if your brother or someone you loved was working covertly for America and then they were executed because Manning released information that outed them to the Taliban, you'd be okay with that? You need to look at the big picture rather than follow the morons touting this as a free speech issue. Free speech is being able to say our President is an idiot or the Tea Party is asinine. It is NOT freedom to betray your country and release info to our enemies that causes the deaths of people risking their lives to keep you free.
Well the US shouldnt be having top secret covert illegal operations should they their. its their own problem if they decide to do a black op and it gets blown
Idiot, they are not illegal. Covert during wartime, you absolute dolt, means information/reconnaissance. You know...Keeping our soldiers alive against the insurgents. You remember the insurgents who like to strap vests onto little children & blow the kid up in the middle of a crowded marketplace full of civilians. Those insurgents, numbskull.
Didn't ANY of your family fight the nazis, or were they all 4F with descendants who went to Canada from the US in the 60's Hmmm?
He knows he is not getting off. The things he is accused of are execution level offenses, but they are going to be lenient with him because he is no hero. He will probably get life in prison, so he can fade gently into obscurity. Unless his actions, conclusively without a shadow of doubt, gave innocents into the hands of the Taliban, leading to their torture & massacre. They might be moved to seek the death penalty if there is evidence of children being victimized by Manning. Taliban tortures can be extremely gruesome & barbaric. This might happen in particular if he chooses trial by Officers or if he chooses trial by non commissioned officers. In trial by judge, the judge is likely to keep to the lenient approach. A group of either officers or non commissioned officers making the decision would likely give him the death penalty if graphic evidence horrified them enough. Their instinct to protect non combatants would be outraged if it is demonstrated Manning handed them over to be brutalized to death.
The more education one has, the more likely they are to see issues liberaly. If I were Manning, I would MOST DEFINATELY not choose the option of having enlisted men on my court martial panel.
how so? you dont need an IQ over 100 to figure this out. Theres a very slim chance this guy is going to get off no matter how he choses...
Its a Shame the prosecutors didnt seek the death sentence as he deserves. IF he does get out, company would be stupid to hire this guy...
So you are saying that someone with an education or higher IQ wouldn't join the military? That comment reflects your complete misunderstanding of the recruiting and enlistment qualifications and process. Only around 35 percent of the population can even get a high enough score on the ASVAB to qualify. You owe a lot of people an apology.
So I take it that you obviously are not a "liberal" thinker based off of such an ignorant comment like that. Not only was your comment ignorant but deeply insulting to every ENLISTED service member that has defended your privilege to live your life void of having such "education".
I would have no problem and have enough intelligence to put that BIGFOOT us your a$$!
I wouldn't want a group of officers either. Officers have a code of honor & conduct that is rigid due to officer training. They have a protective attitude towards the soldiers serving in their commands. Do remember that their sympathy would be on the side of keeping their command safe. That is antithetical to Manning's actions; the information he stole, put others' lives at risk. If evidence is produced: of harm suffered to fellow soldiers, or that non combatants have been harmed with information obtained by Manning... The officers are likely to ask the harshest penalty available as a matter of honor, & to have Manning serve as an example.
By the way; I personally know non commissioned officers who, after scoring in the top 1% of the ASFAB, were offered a berth at a military academy & turned it down due to a keen interest in fields not covered by the academy. Not everyone who serves in the service is interested in being an officer. Especially, if their genius is in an unrelated field. Most non commissioned officers fit into this category, They have a phrase to denote elitist snobs. They call them book learned. The one I know best ; chuckles about people with double degrees who "could get lost in a telephone booth, & need a map in a closet". He also memorized the social security numbers of every man in the 130 member division. He could even tell each person where he was from based upon those numbers. Consider this little chiding, a life lesson. Non commissioned officers are the backbone of the military service. Officers issue an order, non commissioned officers accomplish those orders. Mensa has been after the guy for years, he is not interested. I certainly wouldn't call him unintelligent... He would probably reply in words that would require the usage of your collegiate thesaurus to decipher.
Good. Good riddance to a traitor.
If he wanted to create an exposee, he should have become a reporter. He abused his status as an intelligence analyst to make a name for himself in the history books.
Then he tried to make it a societal issue by saying "oh, look! they're persecuting a gay man!"
I hope they put his bottom-feeding, dirtbag corpse into the deepest, darkest hole there is.
That would be the space between your ears. Do you really want him there?
Bigfoot, You just don't get it do you? The issue is that this soldier broke the law of which he was deeply aware. He didn't do it for any other reason than to hurt the Army. In doing so, he placed his fellow soldiers in greater danger. Though it likely cannot be proven, he may have even cost some of them their lives. Military prison is not going to be a pleasant place for this young man.
If there was still real justice for traitors like him, he'd be hung.
Let him rot in obscurity. There is an excellent reason not to hang the blaggard. It prevents the simpletons who think he is a hero from considering him a martyr to their idiotic notion... that absolutely all information must be shared at all times. Those blithering idiots probably tweet everyone about the aroma of their latest bout of flatulence. Not only are there things good manners should limit disclosing, there are personal things that are limited, like medical records. Why is it so hard for them to understand, that during wartime it is stupid to reveal things that help the enemy you are fighting? Manning intended to harm members of the military maliciously & garner attention from his treachery. If there is no cause celebrity associated with Manning, the attention will fade away as he occupies his well deserved permanent home, & good riddance.
Wow, he really gives gay soldiers a bad name.
You reveal YOUR OWN agenda, not his.
Total hero. 10 years from now they will be making one of those Patch Adams / Dead Poet's Society movies about him being a patriot in a war-mongering, ignorant and bloodthirsty time. Please note that his leak exposed MURDER after MURDER and the information has NEVER been used to harm an ally, unlike some people would like you to believe around here.
As far as I am concerned the whole case should be thrown out due to Obama's pretrial declaration of guilt (come on people, how bad is that?)
Ten years from now he will still be in jail.
I agree. He most definately is a hero a la Daniel Ellsberg. Whether he is still in prison 10 years from now will speak volumes of how we evolve as a people.
And you are a troll who more than likely weighs 700lbs and has not seen your balls or daylight in decades.
For the sake of arguement, lets say your right and Manning was motivated by some rightous need as an american citizen (ala Daniel Ellsberg) to expose something he thought was a war crime... How do you explain why he knowingly and willfully leaked 259,999 other pieces of National Security information? No matter how you spin it he aided and abetted the enemy by leaking tons of unrelated information and that negates his Daniel Ellsberg defense. The man is by definition a traitor.
Hero? Really? So you take the incredibly naive and simplistic "the ends justify the means" approach to this? The point isn't whether or not the leaked information DID cause harm, it's that it was illegal to take and disseminate it in the first place, and that it MAY HAVE caused harm. The idea that freedom of information means that absolutely nothing should be classified, and every single piece of information should be made public and posted on the Internet is preposterous and flat out ignorant. Whether or not your small mind can comprehend it, there is good reason to classify certain information. Treason is treason, if this gentleman is found guilty, I believe he deserves a stiff sentence. We have rules, and we have law in this society, and the fact that one disagrees with them as has a little band of merry men to support him doesn't make it ok to ignore those laws.
What about the undercover agents who were killed as a result of this man's actions? He is an accessory to murder.
Nobody was killed because of his actions.
Right after the leak; the families of people who were exposed on Manning's information started getting dragged out of their beds at night by the insurgents, Anya. Their belongings were found abandoned in disorder where they lived. They were in their homes that night & then missing in the morning. No one in a poor area like that goes off without anything... They would need something to survive the cold at night. Insurgents have a history of torturing & slaughtering families suspected of aiding the soldiers, Anya. Think...Think hard. Your precious Manning has the blood of children on his hands. If you support him, then you think it is ethical to point out people to be murdered. After all, he wanted to hurt the army, so it makes it OK, RIGHT???
" information has NEVER been used to harm an ally"
How, exactly do you know this? Also, how are you magically able to predict that the leaked information (700,000 documents) won't cause harm in the future?
How do you know it won't?
Too bad Wikileaks have officially stated Bradley has nothing to do with he documents and haw never been involved with the group...
ok lets look at the charges: "The charges against him include aiding the enemy, wrongfully causing intelligence to be published on the Internet, transmitting national defense information and theft of public property or records."
Judging by these charges what will happen is probably what 'should' or 'will' happen, i.e. some sort of sentence for like about 10 years to one or two lesser charges, which will eventually be reduced even furher (sic) on appeal, not to not mention that the whole thing possibly gets relitigated at least once before the final charges stick (i.e. at least 1 SCOTUS ruling). Probably ends in a final plea bargain after about 5-10 years. Maybe time served, maybe a tad more. Which in my estimation would be too harsh, but given the apparent need of the judicial system to 'send messages' to deter, that is what is most likely to happen, barring official pardons or clemency of some sort.
To wit, notice they are not evening trying him with treason. that would be preposterous no less, so no one should expect them to add that charge. secondly, nothing he did was on purpose to 'aid or abet the enemy' (charge #1). ask yourself, which enemy? where? are we even at war? which war that congress has declared? these aren't just legalistic retorts, these are real bonafide, almost mandatorily exculpatory and indemnifying reasons against any possible unchallengeable and sustainable charges on the issue. third, i've never heard of the crime of "wrongfully causing intelligence to be published on the internet". A big LOL, if i may say so. So anyone ever heard of that type of charge before? On its face, or shall we say 'prima facia', it appears to be an either pre or ex-post facto made up charge, perhaps seldom if ever used, of dubious origin as to whether statute or rule, for the military code no less, with essentially little parallet to the civilian world no less, to which one might say, nearly all the persons of the earth would be guilty. Most honorable people actually TRY to disseminate intelligence on the internet, else why are we all here, save for basic communications?
I suppose he did "transmit national defense information", but so does everyone who works for the D.o.d. The charge is actually considerably vague, so its hard to comment on the specifics, and vague charges are notoriously difficult, if not impossible, to stand up in court. Finally, he was charged with 'theft of public property or records'. It's a tangential, yet not altogether too uncommon charge – i'm sure you've heard of locals getting charged with similar acts from time to time in your local police and court blotters, which actually sounds like something not likely more than a misdemeanor in effect, which in an electronic mode no less has some various mitigating influences to it. Overall, the fact that we are not at declared war with anyone, the fact that the state department came out and declared a minimized effect ofrom the releases in order to save face, the fact that it would be impossible to prove that any actual damages from the releases occurred, the fact that some actual 'whistleblower' type wrongdoing was cleary outed, and lastly the fact that the entire 'arab spring' type revolutions and overthrows, so cherished by our military-industrial complexes no less, and so lauded by our own commander-in-chief no less, could pheasably be contributed to the freedom from secrecy in part the result of revealing diplomatic cables contained in the leaks, mean that what sticks in this matter, if anything, is likely to be quite small. Let's not forget the counterbalance to the public relations issue here either. Just as much as the 'system' would like to deter future such conduct, there is also other assorted issues here which might very well merit an overall reduction in the supposed seriousness of his actions, at least from a public relations perspective, not discluding rank, sexual preference, recruitment, position, and responsibilies entrusted with, and access.
What a bunch (and a big at that) of useless drivel.
Yawn...!
You could have said EVERY bit of this in one very short paragraph. One thing for you to note: The military doesn't need Congress to make its own rules.
Ever heard of the repeal of "don't ask, don't tell"? Congress does oversee the UCMJ. Luckily, most of the time, Congress has enough common sense to let the Professionals do the thinking. Go back to offering opions about something you know about, however little that might be.
Actually, the military IS beholden to Congress.
Excuse me..... aiding the enemy during wartime IS a death penalty offense. A state of war was declared after 911, that has not ended. Earlier articles said the prosecutor was being lenient by not seeking the death penalty, they are seeking life in military prison & they have more than enough evidence to make it stick in military court. This is a military court & the penalties are under the military code of justice.
Oh, by the way....After he finishes his time there in the military prison system he is still able to be prosecuted on federal & state charges for those same actions. It is not double jeopardy because this is not being tried in a court of law, yet . He can still be charged for the same action AGAIN in the law court after he serves his military court sentence in a military prison.
Welcome to the military double slam. ALL recruits are taught about this BEFORE signing the military service oath placing themselves under the code of military justice. This is cold hard FACT. Ask any military service member. They make jokes about signing their life away. Their sacrifice keeps you free. That sacrifice includes some of their freedoms & with the knowledge that they can be asked to risk death itself at any time. WHAT...Did you think your freedom was free, nope bought & paid for by your service members, Bless Then All!
So, they are going to ask for life in prison for this scum bag, and taxpayers will have to feed, clothe, give free medical, and anything else he may need. A firing squad would be much, much, cheaper. Maybe $5.00.........
it only cost 5 dollars a day no biggie
Has the execution of hundreds of people in Texas succeeded in eradicating crime in your State?
Well it's about time – "Manning was held in maximum custody beginning in July 2010" – that means he has been held in maximum security confinement WITHOUT being charged with a crime for a year and a half – how is that for America's Legal System? Land of the free my butt...Some people don't have rights.
He's not a civilian. He waived his rights when he joined to serve the Military.
Why on earth, then, would anyone in their right mind ever consider joining an organization whose 'membership' facilitates the elimination of their rights?
The normal civilian judicial system does not apply to members of the military for crimes committed while performing military duties. Maybe you should read the UCMJ.
Mr Smith you are clueless
Not to mention that, oftentimes in cases like this, the DEFENSE lawyer will have their client ask to waive their right to a speedy trial. Why? Because it gives the lawyer more time to come up with what they hope is an affective defense of their client. Otherwise, they're very limited in what they can accomplish.
But hey, I guess it's easier to jump to moronic conclusions than to do a little research, eh?
Why should someone who releases classified information get normal American rights? He signed a non disclosure agreement from the start, he knew the consquences and he deserves the maximum punishment and if you do not agree you are not American. You are suppose to support your country not a dirt bag who does this. Go to China or Russia and do that and watch what happens they will kill you without question. Atleast he will be able to live.
Well considering that the release of about 700,000 documents is involved, it is not surprising that it has taken this long. Remember, Manning did not read these 700,000 documents, but the investigators probably had to.
It often takes less time to commit a crime than to investigate a crime.
He is being held for a military court of justice, not a court of law, YET. His first sentence will be under the military code of justice. Aiding the enemy during war time is a death penalty offense, they have chosen to try for a life sentence. There are also 3 lesser offenses.This is ONLY his military trial & punishment.
Even when he gets out of the military prison(if ever) he can still be tried AGAIN on either federal or state charges for any of the same offenses in a court of law. Plus the state or federal government can add on ones he has not been already charged with. Where ever he handed the stolen information over is a crime scene for stolen property, for an example.
THEN the state or federal government gets to sentence him IN A COURT OF LAW. At that point he then SERVES HIS SENTENCE IN A STATE OR FEDERAL PRISON. At any time in this process he may die of old age. If the military sentence is life +3 other charges, the rest might be moot.
I read about the first 3 comments,that was enough foolishness for one morning. CNN better get it together or go in the immature pervert business.
freebradleymanning- you are awesome, you made this entire thread awesome to read with your throatfucking cock gagging,cum guzzling, TSA fucking , comments hahhhaha
Thanks. It's good to know that my music turns on groovy people such as yourself.
What I don't understand is how this NOBODY, this immature kid, a guy who should be delivering my pizza, not engaging in intelligence work, got his hands on top secret stuff. Are we sure the right people are on trial?
It was part of his job to work with the things that he gave to Wikki Leaks . He should be put to death, he did not think about people who's life that he put in danger that may be killed from the things that he put out .
You have it right
Because after 911, the IC was beat up by some politicians about not sharing information and keeping everything secret. So, in response the IC overreacted and decided to open up data bases to anyone with a clearance but without verifying Need to Know. Everything was Need to Share.
Manning is the result of this over reaction.
Shoot, you'd think they'd cut the guy SOME slack after being named the Super Bowl MVP.
Why?
America wouldn't cut slack to Sam Giancana after he offed JFK.
really? Do you not have anything better to do than troll a CNN blog at 2am?? and no I am not even going to bother checking back to hear some snarky insecure reply from you, so do everyone a favor and crawl back into your mother's decrepit womb from whence you came...or get a life
hahhaha.. thats funny.. thats what i was thinking
Manning will do well on the prison football team. He may start out as a tight end, but he will end up a wide receiver.
The Whistleblower Protection Act of 1989 is a United States federal law that protects federal whistleblowers who work for the government and report agency misconduct. A federal agency violates the Whistleblower Protection Act if agency authorities take (or threaten to take) retaliatory personnel action against any employee or applicant because of disclosure of information by that employee or applicant. Whistleblowers may file complaints that they believe reasonably evidences a violation of a law, rule or regulation; gross mismanagement; gross waste of funds; an abuse of authority; or a substantial and specific danger to public health or safety.
The original video he released shows the murder of civilians including an AP reporter...which the government tried to cover up. You cannot say that a lot of the information he releases fits into the above Whistle blower act.
Are you kidding me? Maybe you forgot, this was a military man. And you cannot deny that (at the least) some of what he leaked was confidential. As a result, he broke MILITARY LAW. He isn't protected or being tried against CIVIL STANDARDS.
the whistle blower act is in place for GOVERNMENT employees...the dude will get off unless they can prove that he had "reasonable belief" that the government was acting wrongly.
here is the video of the helo attack that killed these civilians...the original video Bradley Manning "leaked" and was charged with.
He ain't getting off.
He's fucked.
Freedom of speech, my pimply ass.
That's a good thing, "he's fucked" that is. Hopefully until he has to wear a diaper if he doesn't already wear one.
Maybe he can borrow your mom's Depends.
After she's already baked a loaf, that is.
I'm sure she and a lot of others would enjoy pushing a shit loaded diaper into Bradley's pussy face.
Yep, clearly saw at least two AK-pattern rifles and an RPG launcher. Don't walk around in groups of armed men when there are attack helicopters flying around.
Oooooohhhhh!....
What a kinky old broad. Hey, M2M, if me 'n yer mom hit it off, maybe you'll call me 'dad'.
I always wanted a family.
That wouldn't work. My mother isn't a man or boy. So you wouldn't like her. The only woman you could possibly be attracted to is one that had a face like Bradley's ass.
In prison he will be blowing...but not whistles. I hope he enjoys the flavor of smegma.
You appear to be knowledgeable about these things. Tell us how it tastes.
Smegma, that is.
I wouldn't know. I'm not defending this asshole you are. So if anyone has experienced the flavor of dick cheese it's you.
Extra tangy when smeared on a Ritz cracker.
You have no idea what you are talking about . Maybe you should come over here and fight and let some a-h tell the people that want to kill you know where you are . Leak that fool
C.M. – the Whistle-blower Act does not cover people who violate non-disclosure agreements.
Wow, some people are not very bright. Great research on the wistleblower act... however, you missed one crucial detail. The wistleblower act applies to government agencies outside of the military chain of command. All branches of the U.S. military are exempt. Not to mention, the Wistleblower act was not meant as a means for disclosing classified information that did not reveal any broken laws. Yes, some of the information released revealed crimes, but most of it did not reveal any criminal activity. Much of the stuff that did not reveal criminal activity still has the potential to harm the United States by being released.
Are you kidding me? He gave it to the wrong people.
90% of the prison population will welcome Bradley as their new girlfriend.
Yeah......you outta know, eh, sweet-cheeks?
You tell me. You keep defending this emotional piece of shit.
Hey!
I'M the 'emotional' one, fuck-o.
Then visit him in prison and stick your ass against the bars and call him your hero.
Awww....fuck that!
Conjugal visit's where it's at, darlin'.
He did not have the right or authority to release these documents. Especially since this information was likley used to by others to commit murder. He has blood on his hands and so does that self appointed conceited maniac Julian Assange.
There's far more blood on the hands of papa Bush, his retard son, and your glorious Obama.
Get out of America you fucking retard! You dont deserve the right to be called an American
That's great. If you have actual evidence of illegal acts commited by them, then it is your duty to report this to the authorities. But you won't do that because you really don't have any evidence do you.
The Whistleblower Protection Act of 1989 is a United States federal law that protects federal whistleblowers who work for the government and report agency misconduct. A federal agency violates the Whistleblower Protection Act if agency authorities take (or threaten to take) retaliatory personnel action against any employee or applicant because of disclosure of information by that employee or applicant. Whistleblowers may file complaints that they believe reasonably evidences a violation of a law, rule or regulation; gross mismanagement; gross waste of funds; an abuse of authority; or a substantial and specific danger to public health or safety.
UCMJ. Learn how it works. Learn that it isn't the same as civilian law. Then you'll know to quit posting this non-issue Act.
FUCK IOWA!
NOT EVEN A REAL FUCKING STATE.
FUCK IOWA IN THE EAR!
Manning illegally gave away about 700,000 documents. Are you seriously saying that Manning read all these documents and that all of them show illegal acts.
So if I can find one of the 700,000 documents that does not reviel a crime than your argument about Manning being a whistleblower falls apart.
Do you really think Manning had any idea what was in those directories he downloaded? Manning was not in the military long enough to read 700,000 documents.
I'd like to see him get the death penalty, only if he's found to be 100% guilty. He is a United States Service member and held to a higher standard than the civilians in the country. Maybe it would prevent others from betraying their country if they see that they will receive very harsh punishment. They should do away with life in prison as well. Why should the rest of Americans share the burden of paying to house someone in prison until they die naturally. Just sentence them to death, that would take care of over crowding within the prison system.
There's a million other people behind bars who are far more deserving of death than this guy.
Not really and you can join him.
I'm hoping someone in prison will take care of that for us. Perhaps someone could introduce his rear exterior to the solid end of a broom stick. You know – he gives it to the US, we give it right back, kinda thing. Would make for some great laughs and put this POS out of his misery. I know, a bit morbid, but totally justified.
Well said. I agree wholeheartedly. I'm hoping he gets raped in the most violent of ways.
Only queers harbor rape fantasies involving broom sticks. The army hates queers.
Just ask Brad.
You do realize a lot of the people who are in prison for life are nonviolent drug offenders, right? And, while the three strike law can put a marijuana user in prison for life, rapists and pedophiles can get off with far less than that. The drug war is, and I mean this literally, unconstitutional. The constitution does not give the federal government the right to criminalize a substance. Only states are capable of this. Why do you think the people of the early 1900's passed an amendment to ban alcohol use? Because, in the early 1900's, people still respected the constitution, and realized that if you wanted to prohibit alcohol on the federal level, you had to do it through an amendment to the constitution.
Are you a fan of the constitution? If so, you should really review the things you've just said. Please, don't take any of this in a hostile manner. I'm not trying to pick a fight. I'm just trying to point out some of the holes in your logic.
Hero.
No, he's a loser and an emotional sissy. I hope he squeals in prison while being forcefully bent over.
Just like you squeal at family reunions?
Hey FREE BRADLEY MANNING.. SUCK YOUR OWN DADS DICK. BLAH BLAH BLAH.. YOU DEAD YET? YOU'RE TOO STUPID TO BREATH.
Awwwww.....
Hit a nerve, did I?
Boo-fucking-hoo, princess.
Pay no attention to the troll, Fackoff... he only spouts off to try and make himself look "cool", while he's really just trying to makeup for what he lacks down below
Sayeth the lady-boy.
I think what he's TRYING to say is this... there are rules, rules and oaths tha have to be taken as a part of the military and especially for those with special clearance. To make a "rule breaker" into a HERO sends the wrong message. What laws were broken that were revealed in those cables doesn't make what Manning did any better or any more justified and that's what the jury will be deciding on. He will be found guilty, without a doubt. Although some think releasing the documents did no harm, that is not true. There was a lot of inflammatory information in the cables that upset many relationships, gave details about spying on other countries, discussed military strategies, strengths and weaknesses, etc. If you think for a minute that our enemies are not studying those documents for ways to strike or harm us, you are very naive. This was a huge security breach, and that's why he's being tried for his criminal actions. He put us all in danger, two wrongs don't make a right - and it certainly idid no good either.
Cut him loose at once! He did nothing wrong!
Except he did, so no.
As an all knowing carbon based miracle, I predict with certainty that BM will be flushed from society within 5 years.
Alot of people here are arguing that he should not be punished for releasing documents that outlined illegal actions by the US Government. Ok – I don't agree with his methods, but if that's all he did, I'd say leniency should be considered and he might have a "whistleblower" argument.
BUT... that's NOT what he did. He released them ALL. Including the classified documents that didn't need to be seen and were otherwise not illegal. In that respect, he is a traitor. Had he only released a few documents he deemed illegal and perhaps the video, then you might have an argument. As the facts stand, he released much more and should be punished severely and accordingly.
Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah...........you dead yet? No? Well, then – I guess it didn't amount to shit. Did it?
Typical liberal. Can't argue the facts so resorts to name calling and immature rantings.
Says the war loving, chickenhawk pedophile who names himself after one of man-kinds biggest mass murderers.
You wanna dish it out, shit-stain?
Then take it.
Your son will die in prison, Mr Manning. Your rants are cute, but the rest of us will be laughing our @sses off when your son is finally convicted.
Now go back and cry in your corner you little weak tard piece of liberal dung. Let the real men and woman carry on a conversation over how to best deal with this traitorous scum.
Now THAT beats the living shit out of a "typical liberal" retort. Now we're talking.
Yeah, you miserable, lonely, blood-thirsty cunts will probably get your pound of flesh......but in the meantime, you can all suck my yeasty cock.
your gay and living in your moms basement. put the cock down and move out
He should have raped and murdered somebody. He only would have gotten 25 years...
Put this traitor in front of a firing squad already!! See what happens when you let little "sensitive prissy boys" in the military, treason in the name of peace and humanity..
When you pull your step-dads dick out of your mouth, feel free to enlist.........'patriot'.
Fuck you and the horse you rode in on, you gutless, war-loving, chickenhawk cocksucker.
@ FreeBradleyManning, at this point your ignorance and stupidity are compounded by your inability to articulate an intelligent argument supporting your beliefs. Shouldn’t you be in school, are you cutting class?
Ok, ok.. jokes on us. Somebody must have let Manning get access to a computer from his cell.
It's 2 in the fucking morning, numbnuts. What fucking class am I cutting?
Pull your 4" dick out of your little brothers unconscious ass.
@ FreeBradleyManning I’m not one to pass judgment on someone’s sexual orientation, to each their own. But what is this fixation you have with people’s Junk. Come out of the closet already, no one here cares. Not two in the morning where I am at, just goes to show that you have no life,………. Tell me is your mother’s basement cold this time of night. You must be uncomfortable sitting there with your pants around your ankles.
You're right, DWLS. I love cock. Bring it on. I'll provide the 'cheese'. We'll party.
Gee, I kind of thought I was separating myself from fags like you with the "sensitive prissy boy" line. But yes, thanks for pointing out my patriotism. Their is a code of conduct call: Honor, Loyalty, Respect. My philosophy is Death Before Dishonor. You know it's because of brave "Gutless, War-Loving" patriots that you even have a right to rant on this forum and fantasizing about cock until 2am. Get a life loser, your butt buddy Bradley, is no hero. I hope they hang him with the same rope they hung Saddam with, shoot him with the same rifle they shot Bin Ladin with, and dump him in the Red Sea with the terrorists he's supporting.
....says the yellow-bellied swine behind his computer screen.
Sure he's innocent. Let him go and give him a job at a large financial institution so he can release everyone's financial information for the world to see. How much of a hero would he be then? He would have some "emotional" explanation for his actions of course. The same people defending him now would jump to his defense again with the same twisted point of view we're reading now.
Now THAT would be fuckin' sweet.
not all the documents were war crime type docs people... let's be clear there were 100s of thousands of docs. he didn't read them all before he game them up. Sorry, but that's against the rules, its called treason. Book'm danno.
Keep on sucking your father syphilitic cock, lover boy.
Bradley Manning is 10 times the man you'll ever be in 20 life times.
hmm i'm not sure i'm comforted by your accountname...but yes, i agree.
he's not a whistle blower trying to expose something the US was doing thats a crime against humanity and there are probably better ways to take action (and just 'wrong' isn't sufficient reason..we do a lot of wrong things from various points of view). especially in the military, everyone should know how serious releasing classified information is (not serious in on a case by case basis..but serious in punishment if you're caught). the best light i can possibly look at this in is reckless vigilantism...but not against any specific crime..so it's just..insane..and to use his position/access in the military. yes, i think it's (stupid) treason. that being said...his bosses and the system should be overhauled to allow someone who's already done this to do it again. he was already caught leaking info prior to this. he had his a first chance many people never have.
Gee...........that was quick.
I would hope my sons would do the same in his position. He is a true patriot for exposing the truth behind our government's lies. That he may well live the rest of his life in prison for his heroism while the criminal who started an illegal war based on false information live free is the real crime. Disgusting.
Isn't taking anyrhing out of Irac other tham weapons of mass destruction a war crime ?
Its always reassuring to know that iggnorant asses like yourself are able to reproduce. Until you've been in a military position and have dealt with TS information keep your one-sided opinions to yourself. You are obviously completely oblivious to the severity of what he did and the danger he put our troops in, the troops that are fighting for the freedoms of your sorry ass. You are pathetic
YES! He was a whistleblower, not a criminal. So sad what is happening to him. I support him 100%.
I posted I thought he did the right thing. Some have told me he should have used proper channels. When the highest levels of the Military chain of command are complicit in the lies, then those channels are not available. I took the oath. I think what he did brought to light the lies that high ranking military and administration personnel were perpetrating in the name of the United States. However, for the sake of argument, lets assume what he did was wrong. Does that mean that those whose wrong doing he exposed should go unpunished? Those of you who want him shot talk about the damage he has done. None of you seem at all concerned about the damage to world peace and stability done by those who manipulated the US military to engage in actions that were 'unbecoming' the US and the US Military. Even if you find his actions to be wrong, which was the greater wrong and who was the greater villain?
Well put. Sadly the same people will wrap themselves in the American Flag and claim they "support the troops" (in some cases that they are one of the troops) and to expose our governments wrong doing harms America. The issue is most people have a hard time seeing the government and society as two different things and that the former can damage the latter if left to their own devices.
To the uneducated typical American? Manning. People don't even bother to educate themselves about the whole story. They skim through the headline and go "Oh some traitor released SUPER SECRET CLASSIFIED INFO to terrorists?? Hang the scum bag." Really, ask anyone who spouts off about how Manning should be shot what the information that he released contained. Ask them if they saw the video entitled collateral murder. The ones who did see the video and still want him dead tend to be the same bigoted people who cheer for killing innocent Muslims just for being Muslim. You know, the same fear that they have of the Muslims killing them over being Christian/Catholic/Scientologist drives them to relishing in the deaths of any Muslim, be it a terrorist or not. Really, who are the real terrorists?
Good post! Glad to see that not everyone is following this story and judging so blindly without looking at it from all sides.
So glad to see there are still some educated people in this country. Thank you for this post. I think most Americans have no idea of the atrocities that have been committed in this war – PAT TILLMAN, etc. Bradley Manning is a hero to me.
The prosecution of this individual for the screwups of the military and the State Department is really pathetic. 95% per cent of classified material is to cover up screwups by the government!!!!!!! As far as I am concerned he should be released before the courts embarrass the Obamanation Administration!!!!
Apparently releasing info on war crimes merits being locked away in prison for life. I guess the Nazis should of just been hush hush at the Nuremburg trials.
You're too fucking stupid to breath.
Ahhhhhh....fuck!
I meant 'breathe'.
Put two in his head – bill the family for the rounds.
I hope that if/when the power of the state is to brought to bear on you they show you the same respect for your rights and that your jury holds the same contempt for justice as you.
I'll bet you'd love two cocks in your mouth, simultaneously shooting 'rounds' into your empty head.
I hope this loser rots in hell
I hope you are judged just as harshly.
You are the real loser, and the American institutions who raised children such as yourself to be jingoistic pieces of unethical garbage.
If you believe in Hell, then you believe in God. If you believe in God, then you believe in God's Word which said to Forgive.
If you believe in neither, then there is no Hell and your words are just hateful, and have no meaning. So which is it?
Hey now. You should know that most religious zealots in America are allowed to pick and choose which pieces of the bible that they want to believe in. I wonder how many Christians practice and live by the words of Christ. Hint: Not many.
I hope you burn to death in your trailer when your meth lab explodes.
The State Dept. had no other choice than to say that no one was killed or hurt and that nothing was compromised. To acknowledge that anything was actually compromised would be akin to giving away more secrets. I just can not understand that anyone could not easily see that the release of any classified information, regardless of security level, is a threat to our country, our safety, certainly that of our military, as well as the safety and well-being of innocent people around the world. Please try and look at this from another angle: imagine that you are taking a class and you have access to the previous 20 final exams from your professor. Do you think that you would be at an advantage? Do you think that you might be able to identify trends in his approach? Another perspective: some college kids take down a yield sign in the middle of nowhere and put it in the hallway in their dorm. No big deal? Two months later, your wife, 6 month old baby, and eight year old are killed in a 50 mph side swipe because that sign was gone. Do you get the analogy? Things that may not seem to have an impact can have a huge one down the road.
Another fact is this: just because there are supposedly no noteable consequences from his actions, does not change the fact that he broke the law. Even if it revealed things that we all think we "should and deserve" to know, doesn't change the fact that he broke the law. There were several other just and legal courses of action that he could have chosen, but he didn't. He may (or may not) have even had the opportunity to be "heroic"; instead he chose to break the law.
I am not trying to disparage anyone here, just hoping to help others make sense of the issue at hand.
Wags don't kid yourself – if Manning saw wrongdoing going on, do you honestly believe he would have had any chance at all with trying to go through 'proper channels' to report it? He would just have been asking to be silenced, one way or another. In my opinion, as evil and ill willed as we find so many around the world to be against us here in the US, I believe the reason for that is because there are enough people in power here in the US who show those around the world a similar regard that such a sentiment is not without just cause. I have no illusions about the US being able to stand fully apart on any moral high ground. We have examples of evil here in the US that are every bit as heinous and distasteful as the worst of the worst that foreigners around the world can dish out. Manning's only flaw appears to be his weakness in allowing his role in the affair to become known. Otherwise, what he did was something that needed to be done. Those with all the power have long ago defaulted to abusing it for their own personal pet reasons. Those people are determined now to show Manning who's boss and that he fucked with the wrong people. That's why he's facing life in prison – not because anything he revealed is deserving of that draconian end.
John Jackson, your argument completely falls apart when you look at the facts. He didn't JUST release documents that he thought were illegal. He released them ALL. Even the ones that could have put Soldiers lives at risk and wouldn't have otherwise been considered illegal. In other words, he is a traitor. Had he just released the video and one or two documents outlining what he thought was illegal actions, then you'd have an argument. But he didn't do that. Any small amount of good he "might" have done, is overweighed by the thousands of legitament secrets that should not have been released.
Wags, you make some good points and frankly I'm very conflicted. On the one hand, we can't have our soldiers just dumping security information. Which is what Manning did. There is no way that Manning could have looked at a tenth of what he leaked to Wikileaks. It is his total recklessness that I object to.
Just because something is " the law" doesn't mean that it is morally right to follow that law. That was the argument that the NAZIs used to follow immoral orders or laws. Granted this doesn't come close to that level.
But I do believe that society has a right to also recognize unlawful actions as sometimes necessary and consider that as mitigating circumstances and reduce sentences and even dismiss cases.
I for one believe our government has far too many secrets and I agree with those who say that Bush and Cheney should really have gone to jail.
But in the end Manning should go to jail regardless. His actions were extremely reckless and it's important to make an example, even though I feel for him. But I do not feel he should go to Life or that the government has any business keeping him in solitary confinement which they have been doing.
He only confirmed what we already knew, the morality of the American military complex has gone to a new low. We say we bring freedom and democracy, but our soldier are raping and killing as many innocent as they are enemies. It's no wonder we are terrorism is on the rise, we need to get out of these countries. Take away the billions in aid and we might get more cooperation, and be able to feed our own people.
When I look up 'My Lai', I get a boner the size of Texas.
Texas; a state filled with communists and transvestites.
He's a hero in my book. You say you want him thrown in jail, or put to death? Fine, then if its so easy for you to judge this guy like that then you HAVE TO BE FAIR and judge every other real criminal whom has committed treason to this country:
1. George Bush – Went to war with Iraq over lies, and oil.
2. Dick Cheney – Ring leader of the Bush Administrator
3. US Banks and Corporations who have hijacked our government
4. Large corporations paying very low taxes with no penalties while the middle class either pays or GOES TO JAIL
5. Big Oil. They have and even continue to rape this country of every cent they can, and then continue to raise prices
for any thinkable excuse. Iraq issues, Iran Issues, insert generic Middle East issue to use as an excuse to raise oil prices, Speculation, you name it.
If you want to hold Manning accountable for treason then don't be a hypocrite. Hold EVERYONE WHOM IS GUILTY OF ACTUALLY DAMAGING OUR COUNTRY for treason who actually deserve it. Don't just single him out because you can best believe the Elites DO NOT want you to focus that same anger onto them. Go ahead, keep being blue pills and drinking the coolaid the media is feeding you.
Sad.. such a simple mind failing to grasp the complexities of the world. By your logic, you too should be put in jail... we all should. Ever get a credit card? Have debt carry over beyond a month? Own a car that used gas instead of alternate energies? Left a light on when you left the house? Used government supported programs for anything, ever? Gone to the doctor and not paid 100% of the bill? Thanks for contributing to our national problems.
And I have done some things that I had to own up to that cost me financially. I won't say what they were on here, but I took responsibility because the law SAID SO. SO just like us civilians, and Manning have to pay up to what we have done by the laws that are over our heads, then so does every politician, corporations, government official, etc.
People are acting like Manning is the only criminal whom has betrayed this country, when its happening everyday by those I mentioned in my original post. Thing is, the media DOES blast that news all over the place, whether its Big Oil or Big Banks getting over on the people for whatever reason, its just that the people CAN DO NOTHING against those behemoths.
The only people that really get penalized for their actions in this country are the little people, which is US.
Not paying a bill on time is the same as leading a country into war under false pretenses or the killing of unarmed civilians at a safe distance by the crew of an attack helicopter?
Hey everyone!, the utterly perfect specimen known as (Joe) Stalin is lecturing us about 'socialism".
Fucking retard. Please don't breed.
Darn, bad news I just learned that President Bush had every legal authority to start fighting Iraq regardless of the reasons, because Congress gave him the authority to. Chaney on the other hand yep guilty of doing his job, but last I checked being an aggressive VP isn't a crime. Big Oil is mostly oversea controlled companies so don't see how they could be considered a traitor of the USA.
If the president and vice president lied to congress in order to gain authority to fight a war that did not need to be fought, then they did commit crimes. High treason actually. The lives of military personnel have been lost as a result. They deserved better from their commander in chief.
LMAO! Well said Shaun.
Of course Congress authorized military force, they thought they were making decisions based on credible, not manufactured evidence that was a total illusion.
Congressional authorization for the Iraq War was based entirely upon misinformation campaign.
Who cares about Manning and this leak. What is being done to prevent future leaks? Our $640 Billion Government Complex has been unwound by children! Blame the handlers...not the livestock!
Hate to break it to you regardless of security measure they're still only as safe as those allowed access to it. No physical security, no supervision, no regulation will stop someone from abusing the trust bestowed upon them if they want to. It might take long and it might be lower tech, but unless they strip search everyone that has a security clearance and wipe their memories it all comes down to trust.
He should be branded as a traitor & shot. The cost of the bullet should then be paid by the family.
you foolish, violent sheep.
Oh my and we should just turn into the Nazi's.. wow.. People get a grip.. He, again, is a scapegoat for some others inadeqate leadership abilities..
And you should be sodomized into a coma.
And your family billed for the spent seed.
If you were in the military and were aware some of your cohorts were murdering innocent civilians and shooting at children and laughing and joking while doing it, wouldn't you feel some responsibility to expose it? If Manning was the one who released this information, he's a hero. He's also got a lot of courage since I'm sure he expected there was a good chance he would get caught.
I am in the military and you can't generalize a few people to my entire military branch. people innocent or guilty get killed all of the time, BY BOTH SIDES! he is about as much a hero as Bin Laden was Jewish.
99.9% of what he's accused of has absolutely nothing to do with what you just wrote.
I got 20 bucks that said he got paid off by surge or whatever the guys name is. A real course of action would have been an email to a senator or congressman. Then he would of had protection for the leak. He didn't which makes him a borderline tard and not a hero
I can't believe how seriously uninformed allot of these comments would indicate. For those of us who have served, and for those who have held security clearances you know that not only do you swear an oath when you put on the uniform, you also sign a number of documents before you are given access to classified information. These documents make it quite clear, you are NOT to divulge classified information PERIOD! If you do, you are in violation of US title code 18. It was not up to Manning to determine whether or not this information releasabiliity of this information. He is not a declassification authority
To get a security clearance, you must submit to a thorough background investigation, and you must also willingly sign the non-disclosure forms after being thoroughly briefed on the ramifications of divulging classified information . If he didn't want the responsibility to protect classified information, or if at any time he had any reservations whatsoever regarding the protection of that information, then he shouldn't have initiated the background investigation, nor should he have signed the forms. But he did!
Therefore, he knew what would happen if he divulged classified information, He knew the penalties he faced, but he chose to divulge that information anyway. So, now he's going to be punished accordingly.
Very well put. Regardless of consequences, good or bad, he broke the law.
None of the information that he released even put anyone in danger.. all it did was unveil some things that the public "wasn't supposed to see". He will be scapegoated and probably spend the rest of his life in jail.. as an example for anyone who thinks about releasing information to the public.
Did you read every document? How do you know if anyones lives were put at risk? You see.. we can't tell if an IED went off in a particular location because the terrorists got lucky or read a document revealing convoy routes. We can't tell if the informant who suddenly disappeared decided to stop helping us or was kidnapped and murdered.
The fact is will never know the full toll of his disclosure, but make no mistake, lives have been put in jeapordy because of this traitor.
he gave out sources names and their handlers, yeah you want to retract your statement now?
First off you, being in the military, CAN NOT READ ANY OF THE RELEASES... so you violated your orders, lied in your reply, or heard information second hand (which was also prohibited). To date the pentagon has yet to cite one verifiable claim of someone put in dire risk or harmed as a result of the release... they tried a couple times but were debuked when researched even remotely.
Without a verifiable claim you are asking me to trust the same people who lied to be about the wars... which was exposed by Mannings release... ok... sure.
Matt, it really doesn't matter what was in the documents. The documents were classified; he wasn't authorized to release them. Even if he felt something was wrong, anyone with half a brain would know that wikileaks is NOT the way to go about it. He will be punished, and nothing you say will stop the hand of justice. The majority of people are against your position and I guarantee you the best thing that has happened to him is that the prosecution isn't seeking the death penalty.
J,
A majority does not make a immoral act moral nor does it make a wrong right. It is easy to do whats right... what hard is the doing the wrong that is more right. His crime is making the government look inept and underminding their propaganda to keep approval up for the wars. They made it a crime by marking things top secret what NEVER should have gotten that status if our government was operating under the rule of law.
Chain of causation... the first party to make the trespass assumes responsibility for all the acts that follow.
@Matt: Yes there was an order by the pentagon not to read the leaks, but lets not forget the fact that people enlisted in after the leak. I was prior military with 6 years in between service and had plenty of time to read the leaks before re-enlisting and not violating direct orders. Unlike what Manning is accused of. Next time don't assume that everyone break the rules to make yourself feel better about what you do when no one else is looking
It was not up to Manning to determine the releasability of classified information. He swore an oath, and signed a binding agreement not to release it – PERIOD! He knew the consequences of his actions, so now he needs to be put in prison for life.
While he did violate the law and should be wlling to accept the consequence of his acts you must not stop the query there... As St Thomas Aquinas said "An unjust law is no law at all" and by extension we must ask if putting him in jail serves the interest of justice...
What he did was not for fame... or for riches (he could have sold the intel). He released it to a source which he knew could get the informaiton out to every media hub in the world. His goal was to inform and the result was a better informed american voter. The written law can be wrong (as it is written by man and we are all fallen) thus it is the job of the people to ensure justice is served... not just the will of the ruler.
Wrong, Matt. His motives weren't that pure. He was a disguntled kid with homosexual issues and behavioral problems. He did it out of spite; a "I'll show you" mentality. I would agree if something was truely "illegal" or morally unacceptable in those documents, they should be exposed through the proper channels (and ONLY those documents). However.. he didn't just do that, he released a ton of documents, most of which he never read. His actions were more inline with a traitor than a whistleblower; plain and simple.
J,
I never claimed his motives were pure... I would not claim to know his state of mind when he acted. What I am claiming is his acts were not selfish if you view the act by his actions. To claim you know his state of mind at the time would be just as absurd as me claiming his motives were pure. We can only judge on what we know and we know he did not sell the intel nor did he seek fame for it.
Couldn't have said it better myself!
You don't think he put anyone in danger? The report of a Quran being accidentally burned has already caused violence and deaths. Do you REALLY think that in those hundreds of thousands of released documents the Taliban couldn't find one thing to rile up the masses and make someone take a shot at a US soldier?
The burning of the Korans....(how stupid can the guys that burned them get) was discovered by and Afghan janitor. Not leaked by and American.
Shoot the f____ing traitor
what a dick
Bradley Manning is a patriot, he saw what was being hidden from our eyes and he wanted the people of his country to know. He loves his country but hates his government. He deserve nothing short of a small prison sentence, and a discharge.
i say he deserves no more than 10 minutes in prison, shouldn't take that long to ready the noose
Watch the movie "A man of all seasons" to put this in better context:
William Roper: So, now you give the Devil the benefit of law!
Sir Thomas More: Yes! What would you do? Cut a great road through the law to get after the Devil?
William Roper: Yes, I'd cut down every law in England to do that!
Sir Thomas More: Oh? And when the last law was down, and the Devil turned 'round on you, where would you hide, Roper, the laws all being flat? This country is planted thick with laws, from coast to coast, Man's laws, not God's! And if you cut them down, and you're just the man to do it, do you really think you could stand upright in the winds that would blow then? Yes, I'd give the Devil benefit of law, for my own safety's sake!
Last time I checked, leaking information to foreigners was treason. If he wanted to be a whistle blower, he could have gone a much different route and at the worst just been discharged. The military will make an example out of him to discourage others from violating their orders and clearances. I have no sympathy for this dumb kid who wanted to "stick it to the man" and ruin his life in the process.
For the love of all things holy will you people PLEASE read the Constitution before throwing around the word treason:
Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort. No Person shall be convicted of Treason unless on the Testimony of two Witnesses to the same overt Act, or on Confession in open Court. The Congress shall have Power to declare the Punishment of Treason, but no Attainder of Treason shall work Corruption of Blood, or Forfeiture except during the Life of the Person attainted.
As you will note above to convict for treason the state must produce the following: " Testimony of two Witnesses to the same overt Act, or on Confession in open Court." which the state seems unable to do at this point.
The military isn't charging him with treason as the story states: "The charges against him include aiding the enemy, wrongfully causing intelligence to be published on the Internet, transmitting national defense information and theft of public property or records." The military is their full rights to charge him and court martial him. He gave them this right several times: the day he enlisted, the day he signed the consent for a clearance, the day he logged onto a DoD computer which has a final warning. He knew what he did and he knew the possible punishments.
yep, agreed. I'd pull the trigger.
Indeed – he's certainly no 'patriot', and his mental illnesses and sexual confusion are not an excuse for his very serious betrayal of this country.
He happens to be gay, that's not a excuse but I does give you another reason to dehumanize him. Its no matter if you agree with what he did we all know that he acted with conviction when he did this and that makes him a much stronger man than you. Or myself for that matter.
@Common Cents I'm not 'dehumanizing' anyone, merely pointing out the ploy his attorneys were attempting to divert attention and 'excuse' his crimes.
I'd like to shoot a load down your fucking throat, you cum-guzzling faggot scumbag.
England's traitors became U.S. Patriots... So what is right or wrong and from who's point of view? What if these documents saved lives in other parts of the country. Just because something is illegal, does it mean it's wrong from all perspectives? I hope the justice system is fair in this case...
Right is power. Manning lost.
He was a get over trying to make money, that was his whole game – another reason to get rid of thoes brass f**kups who tried him – who you people kidding, if he cared. he would have gone thru approate channels. BYEEEEE
Well hopefully all the liberal traitors to this country will find a huge plot of land far away from the US they can all move to and practice their backwards as s politics. I heard Antarctica has some room!
Hey, buddy, I'm a liberal and would love to see this idiot put away or executed for his crimes.
Don't generalize.
The founding fathers were considered liberals and extremeists in their day. It's the extreme right that's hijacked this country from its roots. So if you can't comprehend this countries origins maybe you should open a book and find out the truth, that backwards conservatives like yourself should go where you belong back to Victorian times. Let the rest of us move forward to a progressive future.
Common Cents, perhaps you should crack open the text books. Our founding fathers were liberals of their day, true. What we now refer to as "classical liberals". Want to know what they stood for? Smaller government and freedom of the people to determine their own destiny. Sound familiar? Yeah, "liberals" of the 1700's would be what we call "conservatives" today. The names have changed, but the beliefs are by and large the same.
@ Common Cents. Please change your tag its pain to read it and then what you say. The patriots of the past tried for years to change view of the crown before going to the extremes they did. The also publicly answered their intentions before doing so. The didn't enlist into King George's army and found their secrets and give it to the French to fight for them. What he did he knew was wrong or he would have gone to the CNN, the AP, or even BBC not WikiLeaks, because if you think anyone of those entities would protect Bush you crazier then I believe you are
You don't just fuck cows......
You married one.
This is nothing more than a witchhunt.
no, he is a treasonous coward, he's lucky if he doesn't get death
And you're lucky if you don't die from Aids from sucking TSA agents cocks, you cum-gargling man-whore.
Incorrect. And don't you have a park or someplace to Occupy with your iPod, iPad and iMac?
the poor guy got screwed by liberal agenda.
"for life" would be way too harsh. make it 5 years.
he is a young guy, have some mercy.
we are merciful, we are christian, we are civilized.
show it.
I consider myself a conservative... yet appearently not wanting my government to lie to me makes me a liberal?
How can you guys call yourself conservative when you seem to clear little if the government is blowing smoke up your backside so long as you get to wave your flags and claim you 'support the troops.' Mind you that while being lied to you can't really support the troops because you have NO CLUE AT ALL what is going on over there... since the source of your information is busy blowing smoke in the region already noted.
Where is the declaration of war? I keep hearing war but yet to have seen an actual constitutional document allowing the last ten years of "war"
Finally a legit argument. Yes the wars are illegal and should be ended. Even I can't disagree with the law of our constitution.
Ron Paul save us... Haha borderline nut but Damn he makes sense on every issue!
The War Powers Resolution of 1973 (50 U.S.C. 1541-1548)[1] is a federal law intended to check the power of the President in committing the United States to an armed conflict without the consent of Congress. The resolution was adopted in the form of a United States Congress joint resolution; this provides that the President can send U.S. armed forces into action abroad only by authorization of Congress or in case of "a national emergency created by attack upon the United States, its territories or possessions, or its armed forces."
That last part is important.. you know, that whole 9/11 thing?
yea, his approach while a bit off the wall is probably the only thing that can save us as a country. Sadly Obama will most likely win again and nose dive this baby straight into the dirt, then I imagine we see some REAL change! Oh well..
Wow that's cool facts, hittler created the same kind of doctrine after burning down German parliment. How that turn out?. Tragedy cannot condone unlawful advances by government. Unless of course you want to be the boiling frog. And no I'm not a 9/11 conspirator. Just pointing out the fact Jefferson is rolling in his grave right now.
Anyone who can't spell 'Hitler', should be throat-fucked to death.
What stuns me is not the fact our government finally got around to charging him (a few years late but who cares about civil liberties these days) but that there are a number of people here calling for his head....
Support the wars or not you really think it is wise to defend the governments actions here? They lied to us over and over about how the wars were going because they did not want us to be informed. They deprived us our right to be informed when deciding our countries direction at the ballot box. A Republic only stands so long as those who vote can be informed with all aspects of our policy, both foreign and domestic.
Republican or Democrat... I really don't see how this can be viewed though the lense of anything other then The People vs The Rulers.
I support the war on terror, and I support the governments actions on charging Manning for treason and aiding the enemy. Civil liberties go out the window while being employed by the US military so they could, in theory drag this scumbag out back and put a bullet in his head. I will give all you libtard puswas a clue. You think there's no such thing as a terrorist? You think there aren't millions of Muslims who hate you just because you aren't Muslim? Well it's true. It's the crusades all over again the question is which side are you on?
hey billy, YOU could be a terrorist too, lots of christian nutjobs in this country too...just because you believe in a deity, doesnt make you right, ohh and DEITY is a god, a spirit. i"m sure you have never seen a dictionary. since you didnt read the article, you must have not seen that the govt. isnt going for the death penalty, because by technicalities, we do have to have a congressional declaration of war, there never was one...
I'm certainly not on the side of cow-fucking pedophiles, that's for sure.
Moooooooooo!!!!!!!!!1
What about treason at a time of war don't you understand? What shocks me is that they aren't going for the death penalty.
WHAT FUCKING WAR?
I hope the TSA goons gang rape you on your way to grandmas house, you fucking inbred cunt.
You've GOT to be kidding me. This guy committed court martial offienses, but just because you don't like the military and you've bought into the Occupy-esque line of bs, you think he should walk? Think again. Ain't going to happen.
I like the military... I don't like the elected officials using legitimate powers we gave them to hide information which the American people have a right to know about. When we send our young men and women over seas to fight for us we should know what is going on so we can, as a nation, alter our foreign policy if it starts to become destructive to our interests.
Appearently expected a government which does not rule but serves its people is to much to ask for in today's America.
No.... it ain't going to happen. Here's what else.......'ain't going to happen'.........
You, ceasing to bugger your 5 year old nephew.
Yes, we are calling for his head. It is one thing to expose something that is illegal or unjust... using the proper channels to go about it. But he didn't just expose some issue that the public "deserved" to know about, he emptied the whole kettle.. including all the stuff that should have remained secret and was not not "illegal" by any stretch of the definition.
To make a civilian comparison – If Pepsi company is treating it's employees badly, fine, expose it. But it doesn't give you the right to also expose all their receipes, how they do business, and interal organizational secrets that are unrelated with the suspected "crime" of mistreated employees. Duh!
So who decides what I deserve to hear? You mean the same guy that needs my vote? Don't think that is a bit of a conflict of interest there?
You guys really stun me at the shear level of blind worship you shower on the alter of state. The worst part is I am sure you consider yourselves conservatives yet you support unchecked government power... shame what our schools have done to a generation.
yes our schools turned into a liberal circus where "everyone is a winner". Look where schooling is headed, it is NOT a conservative approach unfortunately.
Billy my friend... You are not a conservative... You are a big government moral majority... Quit hijacking my party with the rest of your goons and give yourself a new title... Everything you have posted here flys in the face of conservative government.
Mike,
Please quit talking about treason... He does not meet the Constitutional requirement to be charged with treason (which you would know if you read the document atleast once)... You may want to act like a nobel defender of our Constitution but you come off more like a shrill for the government.
Billythecow,
No Civil Liberties do not go out the window when you work for the government... that is why the UCMJ exists... because their rights must be protected. How could a group which swears an oath to defend the Constitution from all enemies foreign and DOMESTIC also be permitted to shread the same when it serves their ends. You like the above poster come off more as a shrill for government...
how does he not meet the constitutional reasons for treason? he divulged secret classified papers during war time and used them against his country. he should be drawn and quartered.
Do you even know wtf ucmj stands for??? Uniform code of military justice. And yes we do shed our freedoms for retards like you. You think you have the right to free speech in the military?! Wrong. Go tell an officer to F-off and see what happens... Military obeys similar yet entirely different legal system than what a civilian gets.
Bahaha try again buddy.
Dustin,
To answer your question for him to be convicted of treason you need 2 witnesses to the same act or a confession in open court... since they don't have the first and odds are he will not confess they really can't charge him with that. It is actually the only criminal charge defined in our Constitution since our founders were concerned about it being used like the king of england used it.
Billy,
It stands for Uniform Code of Military Justice which I assume you know but think you have to be a neo-con to know... Also if you tell a commanding officer to go fly a kite you still have the right to face a jury and be duly tried for your crime. The military has different laws then the rest of us but they are still bound to respect the rights of those Americans who wear the uniform.
does your definition of treason hold up in the UCMJ as well as you think?
Dustin,
Cconstitutional provisions usurp anything found in the UCMJ. I don't mean to be rude but you serve/served and don't know this?
He is a traitor. Air drop him into the middle of Afghanistan dressed like Uncle Sam.
This Manning needs to be tried for treason and executed, as defined during time of war and to pay for the lives lost due to his stupidity.
He did the right thing. A soldier is under an obligation to disobey unlawful orders. Effectively, he refused to keep secrets regarding unlawful behavior by the US military.
Ian, there are channels to report unlawful orders. Those channels do not include publication of classified materials. Soldiers in the field need to know that their Tactics, Techniques and Procedures are being protected, that they are acting on intelligence that is secure, and that the people they are working with in the field are not compromised. If Bradley Manning is found to have compromised informants and agents working for the US then he has aided the enemy. Period. He could have worked with IG to resolve is dilemmas or he could have gone through his Congressional office. Instead he went to an organisation that had no ties to the US Government and could do nothing to help him, and which had an agenda that often runs counter to that of the United States of America.
"I, (NAME), do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. So help me God."
This is the Oath of Enlistment that Bradley Manning swore. Yes he has the right and responsibility to not follow illegal orders, but he also has the responsibility to do so in an appropriate manner that does not put to risk the lives of his fellow soldiers. Manning violated his oath. Manning provided classified information to a 3rd party with the intent of it being published publicly which by definition aids the enemy. Nor did he pick and choose a few choice bits of intel, instead he just dumped everything without regard to it's pertinence to any grievance he might have had.
Good thing they aren't going for the death penalty. Last thing we need is to make him a martyr for these tin foil hat wearing idiots. I'm all for government accountability, but there are certain things the public just DOESN'T NEED TO KNOW. This idiot played with fire and now is gonna end up spending life in solitary while the world continues on without so much as a thank you for his wasted effort. Good riddance, lock him up and throw away the effin key.
What lives were lost?
And how much tonage of "lawful" secrets did he expose along with these 'so called' illegal secrets?
Traitor! Hang him.
Death penalty is off the table. Settle down!
LOL, Anya you must be as bored as I am tonight!
DaveMBA,
LOL! Yep, no debate tonight, right? Figured I might as well invest some time in discussions on CNN.
At Anya: HAAHHAHAH! I no kidding asked myself 2 minutes ago (why the heck am I on here?! I must miss debate from high school!).
I take back all my anger fueled insults that I typed at you. I still dont agree with a lot of what you say, but I will admit that I agree with some of them, (Your comment earlier about Marines and thier oaths helped).
Que the peace and happiness music!
DaveMBA,
good to hear that. I enjoy a good and smart debate. I hate the name calling people without arguments. We don't always have to agree – but if we can learn more about the opposite viewpoint, it certainly helps. (I should get a beer now, too
)
i'd rather we just let the kid rot in jail for the rest of his pathetic life
Isn't taking anything out of Irac other than weapons of mass destruction a war crime ?
manning didn't release all the stuff they took out.
I love all you boils on the posterior of society that use the word "liberal" like a. It's some kind of slur, and b. LIKE IT HAS ANYTHING TO DO WITH THIS STORY. At least your villages have not been denied their idiots. Enjoy your Kool-Aid. I hope its yummy.
Guess you wish now it really was Lady GaGa on that blank CD with her name on it you used to download all that classified data on – huh ya little POS !
HAHAH! 10 points! Best post on here!
Manning is the new liberal hero. What a shock,
His superior officers should be held accountable as well. They were supposed to know what was going on in their unit. We somehow forget to punish these guys who are supposed to be running the military and yet allow these types of incidents to occur. Heads should roll.
Im sure he did all he could to make it a secret from his superior officers. Its kinda difficult to catch someone doing something like this, unless you are looking for the evidence in the first place.
Well, Twain is 100% dead on. If you know the case well, his superiors failed to take away Manning's clearence after a drug and conduct infraction because they were understaff and needed him to do extra work. Idoit decisions on thier part.
"His superior officers should be held accountable as well. They were supposed to know what was going on in their unit. We somehow forget to punish these guys"
No, we always want to punish or blame someone else other than the person who actually committed the crime. It wasn't the drunk driver's fault, it was the bartenders fault. It was the shooters fault, it was the gun manufacturers fault....etc etc etc. it is about time we start holding the people who commit the crimes accountable.
He should be charged with treason if u ask me.
The Govt should be ashamed of how it handled all of this business and the kid.
The scale of justice as we see it here, is: the Govt has more weight.
Now let's balance that weight.
nobody asked you
Scapegoat, and distraction.
And from what I see of these idiot sheep..it's working very well...
Unfortunate they will have to die smothered with lies in their minds. As planned by tptb.
Wake-up, or be shut-up, non-violently..but violently if it has to be that way. simple as that. ( I hope for as much non-violence as possible, but will show someone their guts while their eyes are open if I really really have to..I'm absolutely positive I'm not alone in that thought).
You're choice..make it NOW!
Are you responding to someone? What are you talking about?
Bring it on internet tough guy lol
Someone forgot to take their pills. Bunch of gibberish.
Manning is a scumbag. He took an oath to keep military intelligence secret. There is a difference between a whistleblower and a leaker. He released over 250,000 documents. In order to be a whistleblower, he had to have known what was in each document and then each document would have to have revealed a crime. The truth is, Manning did not read all the documents. He stole them and then dumped them. That makes what he did a serious crime. He should pay with his life. Innfact, he should've already been summarily executed.
Executed huh? The fact that you can vote, scares me.
You are a Left Wing Nut who considers Cops the Bad Guys and the Criminals the Victims. Enjoy your Kool-Aid.
Nope, I actually like cops and I'm for strict penalties where it makes sense. This just doesn't make sense you know.
amen to that
He broke the law (i.e. UCMJ)!! Manning aided the enemy and should be held accountable.
For those of you claiming to be law abiding citizens, and yet favoring leniency for Manning, you are trying to excuse his behavior and apply civilian law. This is not a civil matter. It's a military matter and he should be handled accordingly.
Anya, he is obviously a traitor who deserves to be executed. As stated before he should've already been executed and and buried face down in shame as was custom in bygone days. Him and his like have no place in this nation.
Mike Speakman,
a lot of things were 'custom' in your so-called bygone days. Aren't we all happy that is over? Change!
Summarily executed? Puhlleease. Does Manning deserve punishment? Absolutely, but Manning and frankly the country deserves due process.
I think what Manning did was wrong. But I also think the Military has severely violated Manning's rights as well. There is no way that Manning should have to wait 2 years to be charged.
Justice delayed is justice denied. Manning shouldn't be in solitary confinement.
I hope he goes to prison for a long time. Alot of us go and do our job, for the same pay, with the same risk. Don't break the law, and serve honorably. He didn't, he broke the law. He put lives at risk, and like Jack said, its about saving lives, and Manning didn't care about saving lives.
One could argue that by revealing bad American policies that put our troops in harms way for no justifiable cause, Manning was saving lives in the long run. How many American kids have been lost in Iraq & Afghanistan during these feeble wars? What if we had known the lies and duplicity of our leaders *before* we went to war? Would we have tolerated sending our sons and daughters over there so Dick Cheney could earn a few more million?
I'm amazed Dick Cheney somehow walked away a free man......
Only for the time being Anya...only for the time being.
Kurt. Your argument is a red herring. The fact of the matter is the document leaks did put troops in harms way but did nothing to stop the wars. Everything else is ideological drivel.
Really? Last I heard from our State Department is that those documents did not put anyone in danger. Hmmm...
The Army should be held accountable in more ways than one. We lost the war in the eyes of the world during Abu Ghraib another army initiative. This kid did what he thought was right and he will go to prison for the rest of his life. At least someone out there knows what he's doing.
I'm amazed at all the people who think that the determination of what material should be/remain classified ought to be in the hands of private.
Stop using your political ideology to justify treason, please.
Im all for Wikileaks and the disclosure of infromation that helps even the playing field between corrupt government officials and corporate d-bags, however, you cant expect to steal and disclose secret military documents and not get caught, and furthermore pay a hefty price. Im surprised the death penalty is not being considered in this case, there must be some sort of public relations reason (he can probably thank the media). Treason has never been taken lightly in this country as far as i can remember. Had there been something extremely specific and absolutely horrific that this guy could have uncovered within a few pages, it may have been worth it, maybe there is something they're not saying, otherwise this was not a very smart move.
He commited treason.... he should die, !!! just , do it !!!! a f'n bullet in his head !!!
treason for releasing diplomatic cables - puleeeeze
Yes, just the release itself is treason enough, there was far more than just diplomatic cables in that material. He should've been executed already.
Publishing the truth is "aiding the enemy"? What was the Jack Nicholson line? Oh yeah: "You can't stand the truth." Too bad this boy has to be the scapegoat for lying, deceitful leaders.
It's,
- "I want the truth!"
- "YOU CAN'T HANDLE THE TRUTH!"
are you serious? giving away military info not helping the enemy? The fact that you learned how to get on the internet is a surprise. How can idiots like this really exist, people actually have sympathy for this piece of garbage? He swore and oath like i did and he broke it, hes worthless trash. He knew the consequences of what he would do before had, execute him and let it be done.
he did not release any military secrets are all military ignorant?
The information he release was classified. I now believe that not only should Manning be executed, but a fair number of his supporters on here as well. None of them can be trusted to maintain the best interests of the United States. Then again, they are most likely liberals so that speaks volumes against them.
Here Hitler, the truth is we're planning and attack on Jun 6th, the activity indicating contrary is just a trick. Same as, "we need to do something about the perimter of base X, it's a very easy way to get a bomb on post if anyone out there realized it"
Some has invoked Hitler! It's time to abide by Godwin's law and end this thread now.
I hope he rots in jail, the scumbag.
I find it a bit astonishing that Manning is being charged and will most likely be convicted while war criminals responsible for actual deaths and mayhem like Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Wolfie, Yoo and Bybee remain free and unmolested. Another case of unequal justice in the USA. Hopefully some more rational nation will send some special forces out to rendition Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Wolfie, Yoo and Bybee off the The Hague to deal with their high crimes and misdemeanors.
I really wish someone would make a special task force to remove all liberals. Then we could eliminate all those that wish to ruin our great country by continually spitting on our constitution.
Liberals are the problem with this country? Have you even been watching the recent presidential candidates for the GOP?
LOL.
Yes, the liberals have done far more damage to this nation than all our enemies in the past 100 years.
Try to stay focused on the story at hand. This article is about Bradley.
BUSH! CHENEY! BLA! BLA! BLA!!!!! REAGAN! BLA! BLA! BLA!
I say take your meds and calm down. This traitor, gay rights "guerrilla", and insecure child man will get what he deserves.
No Rothchilds or Buffet in there anywhere?? Hmmmm
1) Not once did I say he should be charged with treason or call him a traitor.
I have only argued that he is not a hero. About what was said regarding the ramifications of his information release, well, you will just have to settle for what you've heard.
I'm tired of uninformed "know-it-alls" pretending to understand Manning's actions. Go serve your country, obtain a security clearance, and see for yourself. Manning is not the knight in shining armor so many hippies seem to think he is. Just because he "rebelled against the system" doesn't mean it was noble or heroic.
He's not a hero, but he shouldn't be sent to prison for life or get the death penalty either. Furthermore the incidents that came to light due to the leak should be evaluated and considered, not every single member of the military is a hero or saint. Now if we could just stop the wars that Congress never agreed to, then we could save some tax money that we urgently need.
Yeah. more tax money to pay for Welfare Programs for Homeless Handicapped Gay Eskimos
Shrek,
all you do is call people names. You are an angry person and you apparently want to pay for wars that neither Congress nor the people voted for. Why don't you tell us about your opinion in regards to Manning instead of spreading your hatred?
"Now if we could just stop the wars that Congress never agreed to"
You make it sound as if the president can act with impunity. Congress in fact agreed to these wars, whether by word or by deed. Congress has the power of the purse and at any time can end our presence in Afghanistan by refusing to fund it past a certain date. They have not done so and will not do so. They are equally culpable in involving us in wars of choice.
larvadog,
why don't you show all us that official declaration of war?
"He has compromised the safety of U.S. Citizens and associates, for what? So some kid at home can feel cool about what he read on wikileaks? What good is he going to use this information for?"
- The release of wiki leak documents showing the killing of unarmed civilians by American troops was the reason why the Iraqi government did not allow American soldiers to remain in Iraq. The Obama admin. asked for immunity for US troops while there, and the Iraqi govt refused based on wikileak videos. Bradley Manning effectively helped end the war in Iraq, and possibly saved some of your friends lives in the process.
Wow, you are reaching very far on that one! Ignorance is bliss for you, eh?
I suspect Manning will be convicted and given a long sentence, perhaps life. In 10 or 15 years when everyone has forgotten all about him and Assange, they will quietly release him. I worked with a guy in Berlin who became an East Germany source/spy named Jeff Carney aka "the Kid". He got 38 years but was quietly released after 11. Similar MO to Manning. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeffrey_Carney
That is why he needs to be executed. Carney should've been executed as well.
How about Gingrich breaking the Stolen Valor Act for his political agenda.
Republican presidential candidate Newt Gingrich, however, said it was "an outrage" for the president to issue an apology on the same day two U.S. troops were killed by Afghan soldiers.
Tell the truth, you really don't care as long as you got yours.
Well I for one am glad we are getting information that should be public because we pay for it. I am sorry he had to break the law to get it...This is a hard call because we can't let national secrets out because someone thinks we need to know on the other hand sometimes we really do need to know even if it is breaking the law....
That's a lot of equivocating you're doing there. Let me see if I can help you out. As a former holder of a security clearance for 25 years, I can tell you that Manning agreed in writing not to discuss or disclose any classified information in an unauthorized manner. Neither Manning nor any other holder of a security clearance has the authority to decide on their own who is authorized and who is not, or whether it's okay for them to disclose it whenever and to whomever they want. They are not the arbiters of disclosure.
That's an important thing to understand. The nature of classified information is such that our national security depends on the integrity of those with access to it. There is no room for what Manning did. You *think* disclosure is a good thing but with all due respect unless you know what you're talking about (hold now or once held a security clearance), you don't know what you're talking about. This is one of those things that is best left to the experts and the press.
I am reminded of the trial of several prisoners in the Presidio in San Francisco back in 1968. Kunsler was the defense attonney and summed up things nicely at the time. his quote was, "military justice is to justice as military music is to music". Manning is being persecuted for letting the world know how corrupt our government is. All the dirt they dig up about this guy is nothing compared to the dirt our government has concealed from us. He is a hero who is willing to be the sacrifial lamb.
False assumptions, jumping to conclusions, etc. Actually the military justice system is much fairer than the civilian one. The accused gets more rights and the process is automotically reviewed all the way up to the secdef. My philosophy is that if you really don't know what your talking about then just keep mum.
Manning is being prosecuted for releasing classified documents alone. That is enough to get him executed. It doesn't matter what was in the documents, he deserves to be executed. I now of the opinion that those who support him deserve execution as well, because they could not be trusted any more than this traitor can be.
good on manning,he has the guts to face the corupt american governments,opening the worlds eyes,and has embrassed alot of people,Manning is honest,not many are these days,he is not quilty of anything,how low is this system,how stupid,having to go to court for been honest,mmm..
Another one who should be sent to the gallows. Manning held a security clearance, he broke trust with his nation and deserves to be executed for it.
This country is so bad all one can do is watch it disintegrate.
Dang shameful to know our country has been taken over by the zionists.
dang shame.
WAKE UP AMERICA!!!!
He's not a hero. Anyone that releases sensitive information that puts actual American Heroes at risk is a scumbag and should be burned alive. He didn't even do this out of any sense of patriotism so stop applying the term Hero – he did this because he's a lonely loser pissed off at the world – he threw a temper tantrum. Anyone who thinks Manning is a hero is a douchebag that doesn't deserve to call themselves an American (and you've also likely never served your country a day in your life!)
I served my country honorably for three years in an infantry battalion and I support what Bradley Manning did.
Then you too are a scumbag, no question.
I served my county for 10 years including the first gulf war and I DO NOT support what he did.
If you served for 3 years in a Infantry BN, then you know what its like to have to pick up the slack of sh*t bird. Look into Manning's history just before he downloaded all that classified information. He WAS (and still is) that sh*t bird.
Your vaulted opinion of him is faith mistakingly given upon the premise that he did something good. In fact and reality is that he has not.
If you served for three years in the military and support what Manning did then I have to question just how honorably you served.
Bradley Manning is a true hero. He has shown the true face of America.
He is a traitor not only to this nation but to the uniform. What he did was beyond irresponsible with untold ramifications. He is going to get what he deserves.
Yes he'll be aquitted.
america have been expose of selling weapons to durg cartel, killing innocent people, and committing war crime... it makes you wonder how many criminal act america government have hidden..
Yes, but George Bush won't.
He a true traitor. He will go to jail for the rest of his life. There's a right way and a wrong way to address issues on foreign policy. Manning def took the wrong way...I could care less about his sexuality, he knew what he was doing was wrong.
Lynndie England went to prison for a little more than 500 days for torturing prisoners and you want Manning to go to prison for life for releasing information that hasn't hurt or killed anybody? Really? So you are OK with an American Citizen torturing prisoners but you are not OK with an american soldier releasing information about war crimes, got it....
@ Anya: What England did was tantimount to fraternity house antics. If you call what she did to those "Poor innocent" prisoners (mostly in jail for planting IEDs, murdering other Iraqis, supporting the insurgency that killed thousands of truely INNOCENT Iraqis) torture, you should see what Al Queda did to the Police in Fallujah in 2004 (poured boiling water on him, ripped his nails off, then they shot him and torched his body).
Dont cite BS as your facts, you're spreading your ignorance and stupidity and judging from what I read on this board, its already growing at a alarming rate on this board.
Anya, not ok with anyone being tortured. In the Abu Gahraib case it was another American soldier, using the IG and the chain of command, that started the process of ending that hideous diplay of ill discipline and out right criminality. As I have maintained many times before, Intel agencies will never reveal sucess for failures, especially if they've been compromised. Sorry, sad facts, nations have secrets that must be maintained. If Manning had an issue with a suspected war crime, then he had a duty to notifify the chain of command and or the IG. I could have respected what he done if he had one that and had been stonewalled. However the evidence points that he didn't even try to use the chain of command or the IG....I was in the military, most of the time the chain of command worked..if you used it....
DaveMBA,
I thought that your government does NOT torture. That is what was claimed all along. Yet you seem to look at England like it was a little mistake or something. It sheds a bad light on the american military and there is nothing you can do about it. The damage is done. Why should Manning get more than 500-something days ? He didn't even torture human beings.
@Anya..stay on topic..Bradley Manning...
@ Anya: IF WHAT ENGLAND DID WAS ALLOWED, WHY DID SHE:
1. GO TO TRIAL?
2. GET CONVICTED?
3. GO TO JAIL?
4. BECOME A FELON (WHICH MAKES UNEMPLOYABLE BY ALMOST ANYONE, INCLUDING STARBUCKS!
Seems like she committed a crime and she got punished and she got EXACTLY what she deserved! I dont think what she did was a small thing at all! But YOU seem to such a unbalanced view of the world, that your mind places England along the likes of Abu Musab Zarqawi! Sorry, but after reading dozens upon dozens of innocent Iraqi deaths at the hands of Al Qeada and killings of schoolgirls in Afghanistan, deaths of thousands of Freedom protestors by Syrian Troops (and on and on within that region), you're position on this whole issue is tantimount of crying over spilled ice cream while a orphanage is on fire accross the street!
MarkinGA,
I'm so on topic. Manning is not a hero, but he didn't torture and he didn't kill. Life in prison or the death penalty shouldn't even be considered – it's outrageous. Face it, your beloved military personnel – they are not all heroes and the wars that cannot be won are bankrupting this country. Give Manning what he deserves (a couple years at best) and solve the real problems.
DaveMBA,
you need to tell me your position on Manning? If England got not even 2 years, how long should Manning get?
Markins right, stay on topic. But before I do, ( Im not done), allow me to poke more holes in your claim that US Govt CONDONES torture: If so, why is it written on all rulebooks about the respectful treatment of prisoners? If your claims that America allows this, then that idoit England along with all her other idoit buddies should have walked away, free. No punishment at all. But that goes against what ACTUALLY HAPPENED: which is a bunch of idiotic, unsupervised soldiers commiting a bunch of abuses (NOT torture), where ONE prisoner died at the hands of a CIA agent and his interragator (not US soldiers). BTW, was the prisoner a innocent bystander? A college professor, perhaps? NO. Suspected bomber of a market that KILLED 12 IRAQIS. Where's there justice? (I'll only grant that the prisoner had no evidence, nor was he tried in court. But remember, this is IRaq in 2004. Not exactly a working country. And its still struggleing). Bottome line: a bunch of soldiers abused prisoners and got punished. Other than one death, no one else got anything that much worse than being beat up (or raped with a baton, which is not yet proven nor even brought up during thier trials), and PALES in comparison to planting a truck full of bombs in front of a elementary school or Iraqi goverment building and killing dozens.
Anya, what country are you from? My friends from France, Whales, England, Germany and Denmark seem so facist compared to you!
Whats my position on Manning? Lets see, if I was a maladjusted, selfish little brat who:
1. Got into fights with my leadership because of my bad attitude and constant tardiness
2. Did drugs (automatically kicked out within the Marine Corps, but hell if I know what the Army does, apperently not enough)
3. Attempted to get back at the military that employed me, after swearing NOT to release SECRET information (I have a SECRET clearence myself, and its a pretty damn clear that you are NOT to release sensitive information that may harm American foreign policy or jeapodize troop lives).
4. Created a heavily edited video that attempted to show that American Apache helo pilots PURPOSELY targeted innocent IRaqi reporters that were (foolishly) filming Iraqi insurgents attacking an American base.
I would give him about 3-5 years. What? Does he deserve to die? No. I would laugh if he got ran over by a truck, but he wont get the death penelty or life in prison. In fact, he'll probably get less than 3 years because its taken so damn long to build the case. What the hell did you think he was going to get?
You dont much about crime and punishment, do you? (my bachlors is in Criminal Justice, and I (as are most military officers) are familiar with the UCMJ as we tend to be the ones doing charges.
DaveMBA,
why did we go to Iraq in the first place? Oh, yeah – because of the lie about WMD's, right. But let me stay on topic. Manning shouldn't be charged with life in prison. He exposed injustice and war crimes committed by personnel of the american military during a war funded by the tax payer. We have every right to be outraged, but it's not Manning who should take the blame.
Dave,
you would give him about 3-5 years. Then I don't know what we are arguing about. I can live with that. I don't see him as a hero – but he surely doesn't deserve life in prison or death (which is off the table already but asked for by some on this board apparently). Maybe we can all agree now that the budget needs to be balanced and the wars don't help with that.
Just to pile onto the responses to anya. You have a bad case of confirmation bias. Everyone has it to some degree, but you are completly blinded by it. Dispite the himilayan mountains of evidence that the us was justified and moral and bends over backwords to the millionth degree to be just and moral - you still focus in on minor details and blow them up to support your preconcieved notion that the wars were unjust and our soldiers are bad.
petejohnson,
please explain to me how the war is being won right now and why it should continue. I think you are the one being blinded and you seem to be OK with your tax money being wasted. Bush didn't even want to show you the funeral of the dead soldiers, keep the people blinded and happy, right – everything is alright – the government has it all under control, right?
@Pete:
Thank you Pete, well put.
Anya, would it help your opinion (and that of every other non-sensical baffoon on this thread that likes to say America is a commiter of so called "war crimes") that I told you that I killed dozens of innocent Iraqi men, women and children during my deployment because I thought it was fun? Or that I give my troops $5 for every bullet they could put through the chest of a 7 year old kid? Because I sure did, I did it in Afghanistan too, in fact, all the officers and SNCOs did. Its written in our docterine.
Really....
No Anya, we'll agree that the budget needs balancing, that Bush is a fool for invading Iraq (he really was, along with those in Congress who voted for him). I know this because I was there. And if you were there (and paid attention), you would also realize that American inflicted causualties are NOTHING in comparision to what Radical Muslims do to moderate Muslims. We've been seeing it on the news, EVERYDAY, for 10+ years. Yet, so far, all I hear from these boards are about how America is the great evil.
Man, I need a beer!
DaveMBA,
Civilians are Civilians and they should be treated as such. Their villages are invaded and they have to leave their homes for weeks – trust me when I say – they don't want any help – they don't want democracy. What they want is for the U.S. troops to leave. And looking at the budget, that is what a lot of taxpayers in the U.S want as well. Manning just helped to make the argument stronger. Let's just leave and focus on the real issues at home.
@Anya: What is this "we" went to Iraq. From the sound of it you never stepped foot in Iraq before, during, or after the "war." I personally was there and saw the country and meet the people. The Iraqi people were fighting along side of American and British troops, Iraqi people were coming to American and British troop for medical care(not battle injuries) to help cure sickness, Iraqi people women complained about the raping and beatings they were forced to endure under Saddam regime. I don't care what was said to enter Iraq, If you think that someone should walk away from people getting brutalized because its not your problem; than you become the problem. I haven't a care for people that take away from the sacrifice that Iraqis, Americans, and British make. What suffering have you endure during that past decade. Go to a 3rd world country and you will see even the poorest American has it better most of the world.
Shaun,
that is exactly what Manning did. He didn't just walk away from the injustice he noticed. Funny how that is?
... this guy did more for America than the entire State Department combined! He's a true HERO! He brought the transparency that Obama only promised (and lied about).
Manning is nothing more than a traitor and should have been executed. All those that believe he is a hero should be executed as well.
COL Lind will not be considering any of the comments on this thread, nor will any appeals boards or courts. Wake me up when this is over.
He is a hero for exposing U.S. war crimes committed in two illegal wars that have deepened hatred of the U.S. around the world.
you are so stupid....
I find the lack of common sense here disturbing. Manning is horrible for what he has done. As someone with the same or higher accesses as Manning had, I know exactly what kind of damage he has done. The secrets he disseminated aren't conspiracy theories about the "military industrial complex" or scheming politicians. Nothing so 'noble'. The plethora of information he released served only to give our enemies insight into our past and current operations and various intelligence procedures. He has compromised the safety of U.S. Citizens and associates, for what? So some kid at home can feel cool about what he read on wikileaks? What good is he going to use this information for?
You are a fool if you think the public deserves to know which contacts we utilize or the locations of certain enemies.
If the public knows, the enemy knows. Grow up, hippies.
strongly disagree... Manning is a HERO... he exposed the CIA's and the Commanders lies, even as they lied to Congress!
Unfortunately you just aren't properly informed. If manning had a noble purpose to expose specific crimes, atrocities, or other happenings of the government, he could have very easily addressed those issues specifically. He didn't do that. He released information indiscriminately and risked the safety of many, unnecessarily. Like I said, The public just has no business knowing certain things, such as:
Mr. Badguy is going to be located at on , says .
Please enlighten me, Why does Anyone other military or civillian intelligence need to know information like this?
Maekin,
"Five members of the infantry unit formerly known as the 5th Stryker Brigade were charged with killing Afghan civilians in cold blood in random attacks staged to look like legitimate combat engagements." (Reuters) That's why.... They walked free by the way.
Anya,
1) There are bad apples, criminals, at every level in every society, In and out of war. The killing of innocent civilians is disgusting and unacceptable.
2) You didn't read my post. If Manning had a noble purpose for disseminating information, he could have very easily chosen specific documents to release. You just don't understand I'm afraid.
Maekin,
I understand you very well, but that doesn't make you right. I have another example for you. Staff Sgt. Calvin Gibbs was guilty of three counts of murdering unarmed Afghan villagers and a dozen other crimes. He can petition for parole in 10 years, so someone who released classified information that shouldn't have been classified in the first place should get the death penalty or life? Really? Are you ok with the killing of innocent civilians then?
That's not what he should get life in prison for, or the death penalty. What he should be judged on is the massive amount of data he released that WAS NOT attempting to expose US war crimes or corrupt persons/actions.
Unfortunately, sometimes information is classified not because of what it contains, but because of HOW it was obtained. How information was acquired by the US is just as important, sometimes moreso, than the information itself. I'll leave that to you to interpret. This might seem like an injustice, but until you've seen it and understood the ramifications, you will just have to agree to disagree.
I'm not saying that all information deserves its classification, I know that to be false. However, it was not and is not Manning's place to assess and assign classifications. Manning was a disgruntled low level analyst on a low level network. I am grateful he did not have more access.
People, learn the facts before you go spouting nonsense. The documents he leaked were among the lowest level of security classification. The State Department has gone on record to say that no one has been hurt or killed, or any sensitive operations compromised as a result of the leak. Lastly, if Manning could legally be charged with treason than the Government would have charged him with it. It didn't. So stop calling him a traitor when he's not.
Maekin,
I understand and agree that he disclosed information when he took an oath not to. I disagree with the notion of charging him with life in prison or the death penalty. I also believe that WikiLeaks did nothing wrong. They released information they received from a source, the organization didn't steal the information. When you let charged war criminals walk free (and they pled guilty often enough) or charge people like Lynndie England with the possibility of parole after 10 years, you can't convict Manning with death. That just doesn't make any sense.
Paul Ronco, Anya and others: Do you really thing that the State Dept. had any other choice than to say that no one was kiiled or hurt and that nothing was compromised? Do you understand that by acknowledging that anything was actually compromised would be akin to giving away more secrets? I just can not understand that anyone could not easily see that the release of any classified information, regardless of security level, is a threat to our country, our safety, certainly that of our military, and most importantly to you, the safety and well-being of innocent people around the world. Please try and look at this from another angle: imagine that you are taking a class and you have access to the previous 20 final exams from your professor. Do you think that you would be at an advantage? Do you think that you might be able to identify trends in his approach? I am not trying to disparage anyone here, just hoping to help others make sense of the issue at hand.
THis guy is a hero. THe US gov is a puppet of israel. wake up and smell the coffee, idiot. go find real news not cnn, fox, etc.
The US Gov't is a puppet of israel? Are you trolling? That is laughable. Please, go obtain and education and come back when you're not high.
This guy is not a hero, but a traitor. Anyone who disagrees is delusional. As a member of the Armed Forces, you are obligated to do whatever is asked of you by your commanding officers in order to protect this country. Not only did Manning undermine his commanding officers to illegally release classified documents and cables, but in doing so, has tarnished the U.S.'s military credibility for years to come. What he did was incredibly illegal and he should pay the price for his irresponsible actions.
So if your commanding officer told you to walk into a room of unarmed civilians, including your own spouse and children, and shoot everyone on sight, you would just do it, no questions asked?
Kurt, stupid scenario..
Kurt, your comment is lame. You draw a false and unintelligible parallel. Manning did not pick and choose data according to his moral compass. He vacuumed up as much as he could and indiscriminately disseminated data that was both supportive of his (dubious) cause and other data that was unrelated. The latter being the kind that was detrimental to the safety of many.
Dumb analogy, huh? The original comment says "you are obligated to do whatever is asked of you by your commanding officers in order to protect this country."
So it's inconceivable that your commanding officer would order you to do something abhorrent in the name of protecting this country? Clearly you have a very limited view of our history, where such actions have been commonplace in various theaters of war.
THANK YOU!!!
I could not have said it better Maekin!
As written by "Anya"
"Five members of the infantry unit formerly known as the 5th Stryker Brigade were charged with killing Afghan civilians in cold blood in random attacks staged to look like legitimate combat engagements." (Reuters) That's why.... They walked free by the way.
And your point is, Anya? It's WAR. Innocents die in war. "They walked free by the way."
Yeah,,,,and they never should have been charged to begin with. No love for the enemy. Not even the enemy's "innocents". Welcome to the world of combat Anya.
cory (Humanzrstupd),
I don't have the feeling that you understand that we talk about murder. It was 'staged as combat', it wasn't during a combat mission – it was revenge for a fallen soldier or whatever....Killing innocent women and children is frowned upon, you know?
As the poster child for the failure of Clinton's DADT policy rots the queens of political correctness, California Rump Rangers, still want these pervs to serve. They are a disaster.
Do they know you got out of your cell yet?
So you're judging tens of thousands of LGBTs in the military on the basis of one man? By that illogic, then all white Christians are guilty of blowing up the Murrah building in Oklahoma because POS Timothy McVeigh was a white Christian?
I think Manning did good. And I grok your point about hasty generalizations, Bill. But I like my fact straight: McVeigh was an atheist.
And what does this have to do with this case?
Everything. Manning's main motivation was the fact that he could not fit and... ...he did get dumped by his boyfriend. Just do some research and see for yourself. I hope that all this will come out at the trial because so far this has been kept quiet as not to damage DADT repeal. Why do you think the repeal went so fast?
FYI, Manning was busted in rank and the Army was about to start the chaptering out process. So he decided to do as much damage as he could before being kicked out, and do it anonymously. He thought he would damage the US, feel good while laughing at the "idiots" who "oppressed" him. However he could not keep his mouth shut, and as every loser, he revealed his deeds to complete stranger who then turned him in. So much for honorable intentions.
Manning was a loser in civilian life and he was a loser in the military. Man-child that could not fit. Loser who thought that he was the arbiter of things far beyond his responsibility or ability. Individual with tremendous amount of anger and a big chip on his shoulder. Now all that is coming home to roost.
CNN Terms of Service, Section 2B, Bullet Point 2. "You agree not to upload, post or otherwise transmit any User Content that is offensive to the online community, including blatant expressions of bigotry, racism, abusiveness, vulgarity or profanity."
Luckily, you are not the judge of what is offensive and what is honest dialogue....
Thank you, Kurt. When in the world will The Terms of Service be enforced? I think they are just empty words. "Blatant expressions of bigotry, racism, abusiveness, vulgarity or profanity" smother all discussions on the comment boards. I thought I remembered once a button a reader could press if a post violated the Terms of Service. I don't see it anymore. I guess they pulled it because when most of the posts had to be pulled there wasn't much of any discussion left?
Calling someone a tuna licking dyke sounds like bigotry to most people.
For all you tree hugging, human rights activist that want freedom of speech...well thats what the comments are, FREEDOM OF SPEECH if you dont like it dont read it problem solved.
Given the massive amount of data that Mannig leaked, I wonder how familiar he was with the details. Was he just ticked off for being deployed and dumped as much data as he could? Did he discover what he thought were crimes and feel some patriotic sense of obligation? Did he just hate the military, the government? Regardless of truth , I assume his defense lawyers will wrap him in an American flag and hold a candlelight vigil for a brave whistleblowing soldier/citizen.
This slime ball had gotten into a tiff with his boyfriends and was angry at everyone. What a little puke.
Nope, his lawyers will be paid off to make the lie, distraction, illegal activity and corruption disappear...but yet it will continue.