DEBATE PREP: Should Pakistan be engaged or contained?
November 7th, 2011
08:00 AM ET

DEBATE PREP: Should Pakistan be engaged or contained?

Editor’s note: This analysis is part of Security Clearance blog’s “Debate Preps” series. On November 22, CNN, along with AEI and The Heritage Foundation, will host a Republican candidate debate focused on national security topics. In the run-up to the debate, Security Clearance asked both the sponsoring conservative think tanks to look at the key foreign policy issues and tell us what they want to hear candidates address.

By AEI's Sadanand Dhume, Special to CNN

The raid in May on Osama bin Laden's compound in the Pakistani garrison town of Abbottabad has brought intense focus on Washington's policy toward Islamabad.  Since then, the weight of informed opinion - in influential op-eds, think tank reports, and magazine articles - has coalesced around a consensus: the current policy has failed.

Ostensibly, since 2004 Pakistan has been a major non-NATO ally of the United States, a status it shares with such stalwart friends as Israel, Japan and Australia.

In 2009, the Enhanced Partnership with Pakistan Act, also known as the Kerry-Lugar-Berman Act, boosted aid to Pakistan by $1.5 billion a year through 2013.  These blandishments were meant to encourage Islamabad to co-operate with Washington in fighting terrorism.

Though Pakistani authorities have at times helped round up wanted al Qaeda leaders from their soil, their overall record has been disappointing.  Of particular concern to the US:  continued Pakistani support for the Afghan Taliban, the Haqqani network and other militants who regularly use safe havens in Pakistan to attack US troops in Afghanistan.

Stepped up attacks by Haqqani Network insurgents in recent months, including an audacious assault in September on the U.S. embassy in Kabul, have added urgency to long-standing misgivings about Pakistani intentions.  The country's powerful army has long used jihadist groups to assert influence in Afghanistan and bleed India in the disputed territory of Kashmir.

One possible response to what is colloquially known as Pakistan's double game - fighting some terrorists while helping others - is to move from a strategy of engagement to one of containment.  This would place less emphasis on carrots such as aid and advanced equipment.  Instead, it would rely more on sticks such as targeted sanctions against military officers involved in aiding America's enemies, and more unilateral Abbottabad-style raids against high value targets.  (Keep in mind that Al Qaeda's Ayman al-Zawahiri and the Taliban's Mullah Omar are believed to live in Pakistan.)

The main idea:  target Pakistan's recalcitrant military while sparing its civilian population and continuing to strengthen Pakistan's fledgling  democracy.  Whether it will be implemented, and how Pakistan will respond, will be one of the most important decisions the president will have to make in South Asia.

Sadanand Dhume is a resident fellow at the American Enterprise Institute in Washington, D.C

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    April 22, 2012 at 7:13 pm | Reply
  2. Sikandar Khan - Sr Repotar, Abotabad News Network

    Heloo falks. I hail from Faislabad Pakistan as freelund repotar to gave you blow by blow of what is go on behaind the back of Pakistan in Bonn German. It is sham USA kill many soljar on Afghan Pak boder forcing Pakistan to baycot Bonn. Some say this was USA grand plan from begining only. Only tame will tell. Anyway so far confrance is going ok no commant by any candidate. Soon as I com by they quite down and hush hush so I am not able to get inside info on anything.Rumor is Pakistan is not being missed much as Mr Krishna from India is showing off and become very chummy with Hillary, Kerzai and Euro leaders who is double crosser to Pakistan anyway. To make matters worstest, Germany served excellant lunch buffet of all Pakistani choice, to entice Pakistani offcials to change ther mind and come to this conference. This is an insult. Anyway the food was most delicious and included Shahi Biryani, Tandoori Chicken, Mughlai Lamb, Mutton Korma, Zafrani Pilaf with small raisins and big nuts, 26 different vegetable dishes of Indian names I can't pronounce, (of course to kiss up to India as usual). There was naan, raita and some pungent pickles. In dessert I had Rasgoola, Galab Jaman, Ras Malai and my favorat Feerni. The attendees have all left for more conference for the afternoon session. So far rumor is Pakistan should have bin here to at least fight with India for what they want before everything in Afghanistan is divid up and taken and all we get is scraps. But as usual Pak leaders do exact opposite of what world is doing. Anyway I am drowsy after this heavy meal so I will pretend to be sleeping with one eye and ear open to catch the gossip and repot back to you.
    Sikandar Khan – Bonn Germany, Pakistan Zindabad !!

    December 5, 2011 at 1:13 pm | Reply
  3. Toni

    Hold on to ur turban pakis cause the hits keep comin!

    December 4, 2011 at 4:20 am | Reply
  4. Ehsan

    Everyone knows pakistan is playing double game. Civil Government has no power, everything is being controlled by Army/ISI. It's time to deal pakistan with iron hand. All opressed nations (pakhtuns, baluch, sindhis) will welcome it. World should get rid of the terrorist and irresponsible state of pakistan. Finish pakistan, 90% problems of terrorism will be no more there.

    November 15, 2011 at 1:15 pm | Reply
    • worldcitizen50

      finish Pakistan? US can't even finish Iraq or Afghanistan. If US turns against her former ally, all American bases in Muslim countries will be attacked and she will have another 177 million enemies to worry about. Dumb suggestion

      November 19, 2011 at 10:24 am | Reply
  5. Jagermeister

    The US is going to wrap up its game in Afghanistan by 2012 and be done – Pakistan has to live with Afghanistan. Anyone who knows anything about history knows what humanitarian crisis unfolded when millions of Afghans showed up in Pakistan in the 80's and 90's...destabilizing the very social fabric, economy and law & order situation.

    Pakistan can't be fighting with every Afghan that is anti-US....Afghans don't want the US there...but Pakistan is stuck in that geography.

    Alqaeda has been dismantled, the old Taliben regime toppled ...... let Pakistan establish its political alliances with its neighbors.

    November 15, 2011 at 12:11 pm | Reply
  6. RCDC

    Let India deals with the problem.

    November 15, 2011 at 6:42 am | Reply
    • Jagermeister

      The writer is Indian, and that is the Indian solution – to make the US 'contain' Pakistan by militarily confronting it. What a moron !!! Pakistan is a very complex country that has been misused if you look at its history by the US.

      November 15, 2011 at 12:06 pm | Reply
  7. Toni

    What is surprising is that none of the so called security analysts really understand the Pakistan.

    Pakistani Army intentionally wanted to create a public confrontation with US so as to diffuse the anger of Pakistani Taliban against it, Pakistani Taliban was calling Pak Armynas heretic for supporting infidel US against the faithful jihadis. And targetted killing of pakistani officers was really worrying them. With the latest confrontation Pakistan army has successfully raised the banner of Islamic Pakistan being threatened by infidel US. With this it hopes to get all fanatics back to its side.

    November 13, 2011 at 12:53 pm | Reply
    • Jagermeister

      This writer is Indian – so obviously biased against Pakistan – and misleading common folk with his national vendetta.

      November 15, 2011 at 12:04 pm | Reply
  8. Raja

    Wafa Sultan-Terrorism and Islam

    [youtube=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lYB4pG3kHIY&w=640&h=390]

    November 13, 2011 at 9:04 am | Reply
  9. Raja

    Understanding the psychology of Pakistani mind
    [youtube=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t2e4K5Wb3o8&w=640&h=390]

    November 13, 2011 at 8:57 am | Reply
  10. Raja

    Why pakis are like this ?

    [youtube=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=up3yuQDAWKQ&w=640&h=390]

    November 13, 2011 at 8:55 am | Reply
  11. Raja

    [youtube=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYymPzrnK5g&w=640&h=390]

    November 13, 2011 at 8:54 am | Reply
  12. Raja

    [youtube=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYymPzrnK5g&w=640&h=360]

    November 13, 2011 at 8:53 am | Reply
  13. ali allah ali

    PAKISTAN- Is the only country in the world which survives, feeds, and gets aids in the name of terrorism.. If there is no terrorism, Pakistans may die of debts and hunger as they have no other exports to feed their children .. so plzz bear with our brothers .. Our terrorist bring us $$$$$ If we do not create fear in Americans, they will not give us billions of $$$ in aids.. we have to keep the factory producing new terror outfits everyday.. we simply can not live without them .. Go and do what ever you can .. our police, our ISI, our Military will produce new terror outfits and keep them armed so that you hardworking tax payers in America can feed our lazy bones ... hahahahaaa....

    November 12, 2011 at 12:06 am | Reply
    • xyz

      Oh please Pakistan's economy was going through the roof before the American war of terror. The place was becoming newly industrialized. Look at the Karachi stock exchange before and after the assassination of Bhutto. Look at the price of currency before and after. Out of all the countries Pakistan's economy has been hurt the most since the fighting has leaked into the region. Who would want to invest in a place that has become unstable. Saying Pakistan has benefited from the American war of terror is idiotic. Yes certain few people have benefited but not the average person. The only ones that have benefited was India since they got a weaker enemy. Idiot look at the history of the region and the bigger picture.

      November 12, 2011 at 2:57 am | Reply
      • AccliamedMan

        Which roof? Roof of the world or Pakistani roof which is now filled with drones? LOL !!!

        Must be a Porky j*rk !!!

        November 13, 2011 at 3:28 am |
      • Raja

        [youtube=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=up3yuQDAWKQ&w=640&h=390]

        November 13, 2011 at 8:43 am |
      • Raja

        [youtube=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=up3yuQDAWKQ&w=420&h=315]

        November 13, 2011 at 8:44 am |
      • Raja

        The real root cause of the problem with pakistan.

        [youtube=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=up3yuQDAWKQ&w=420&h=315]

        November 13, 2011 at 8:49 am |
  14. Keith

    Pakistan is teh true face of terrorism – it shelters, trains and finances terrorists and this with our tax money...

    Taliban is that portion of teh Paki army that fights without uniform... JUST BOMB PAKILAND TO THE STONE AGE!!!!!

    November 11, 2011 at 10:18 pm | Reply
    • Raja

      [youtube=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=up3yuQDAWKQ&w=420&h=315]

      November 13, 2011 at 8:50 am | Reply
  15. Dot_Head

    My dot turns me on

    November 11, 2011 at 7:31 pm | Reply
  16. Real_World

    ())=============D .. Indians can suck it!!!

    November 11, 2011 at 7:27 pm | Reply
    • lachman

      India is a peacefull country, but if Pakistan provokes India in the future, India has the capacity to destroy Pakistan and eliminate it from the map of the earth, like India broke Pakistan's back into two creating Bangladesh in the 197 war with Pakistan, let there be no doubt about it.

      November 12, 2011 at 7:34 pm | Reply
      • Jagermeister

        how is India a peaceful country?

        with Pakistan: fought 3 wars
        with China: fought a war
        with Sri Lanka: funded and supported the civil war (LTTE)
        with Bangladesh: constant border scuffles and fire exchange

        and many more. Spare me the 'India is peaceful' rant

        November 15, 2011 at 12:14 pm |
  17. Kjalan

    Next time please dont put an article by an Indian reviewing Pakistan. This is like an Israeli wrting about Palestine or a an Arab Iraqi commenting abour a Kurd

    November 11, 2011 at 11:08 am | Reply
    • Jagermeister

      Exactly!!!!
      Over 35,000 innocent Pakistanis have lost their lives since this terrorism curse has spilled over from Afghanistan after US invasion. That is more than 10 times the loss of life of 9/11 – how in the world is it possible that Pakistan is supporting terrorists who are wreaking havoc in their own country? their economy is virtually dead due to this war on terror.

      November 15, 2011 at 12:17 pm | Reply
  18. krm1007

    WE SALUTE YOU PAKISTAN !!!!!
    THANK YOU …. THANK YOU…. THANK YOU!!!!
    FOR MAKING USA SAFE FOR MAKING THE WORLD SAFE>>>>>>>>>>>>

    “Since Sep 11, 2001, 21,672 Pakistani civilians have lost their lives or have been seriously injured in the war against terror.

    The Pakistani Army also has lost 2,795 soldiers while 8,671 soldiers have been wounded. More than 3.5 million have been displaced while the country has lost $68 billion due to terrorism.

    Despite sacrifices, Pakistan was still engaged in 'the war for world peace”.

    'CAN ANY OTHER COUNTRY DO SO? ONLY PAKISTAN.'

    November 10, 2011 at 7:53 pm | Reply
    • Fred Phred

      Of course it's cost you more lives.. the terrorists are in your country and are home grown. Terrorist do what they do – they kill to bring your country down so that people will accept any form of government as long as they are safe.

      But stop trying to make it look like you're doing anyone any favors. It's like you p_e_e in the pool and want people to thank you when you clean it out. How about stop funding the madrasses that are the root of the problem.

      November 11, 2011 at 6:36 pm | Reply
    • Shann

      Pakistan is ruled by their military even though there is a civilian president and a prime minister. They can talk about the 'official' stand where as the country is run by the military as well as clergies (Mullahs). These two combinations controls and cultivates the militants. As the confidence and capability increase among the militant groups they become semi-autonomous; but their actions are known two the military and mullahs.

      The number of death you talk about will happen even if there were no war on terror. The semi autonomous militias attack one another for dominance when they do not find a common enemy. Since NATO army is in Afghan, all the groups are united, and are controlled, and to some extent used by the army to 'teach lessons' to the NATO force.

      In Pakistan, the Sunny majority and Shia minorities find pleasure in killing one another. No one is able to stop these murders for so many years. Since most of the deaths are happening at the minority side, no one bothers about it.

      Next, Pakistan steadily sends militants into their arch rival, India. That cause additional deaths.

      In short, for civilian deaths in Pakistan is just unavoidable unless it become secular and democratic. As long as a country is purely religion based, then there cannot be a firm rule. Holy Koran is interpretted by the way the militant groups want to meet their objectives. No two Mullah can provide a consistent interpretation to a verse in the Holy scripture.

      Basically, Allah has said that no one has right to murder His creations; but the Mullah's mis-interpreting some others verses taken out of context to meet their objectives.

      Under this conditions, no one can stop the civilian deaths in Pakistan. I do believe that war on terror hasn't caused any additional number of deaths in Pakistan; but I do know that the 1.5B$ we give them every year is used against us in a substantial way. These are some of the facts.

      November 12, 2011 at 4:06 pm | Reply
    • AccliamedMan

      KROOM or BROOM?

      November 13, 2011 at 3:29 am | Reply
  19. krm1007

    INDIA: On a Goat and a Stick:

    The problem with India is that is built on a system of cultural and societal values based on Hinduism which is a cult. Nations built on a cult seldom survive in the long run. You can only take it so far based on symbolisms of a goat and a stick with a skinny little man aka gandhi banging boys at night and spinning wheels during daytime.

    November 10, 2011 at 7:50 pm | Reply
    • lachman

      It's a real and known fact that India has won stunnigly the three wars that Pakistan waged on India, the third war broke Pakistan into two creating Bangladesh, and I'm sure that the fourth war between the two will dispatch Pakistan in hell, I mean Pakistan will disappear from the earth forever.

      November 12, 2011 at 7:41 pm | Reply
  20. Real_World

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/india/3229253/India-asked-to-investigate-Hindu-massacre-of-Christians.html

    India asked to investigate Hindu massacre of Christians
    India's Human Rights Commission has been urged to investigate the wave of violence which killed at least 100 Christians and forced another 100,000 to flee their homes.
    By Rahul Bedi in New Delhi
    2:36PM BST 20 Oct 2008
    The murders in Orissa state may have been the worst anti-Christian violence since India achieved independence 61 years ago. One nun was gang-raped and over 140 churches, orphanages and other Christian organisations were destroyed and burned.

    The Global Council of Indian Christians (GCIC) asked for a full investigation into the killings, which were sparked by the murder of a local Hindu leader.

    "There seems to be a larger conspiracy behind the attack on Christians and that needs to be investigated," said Sajan George, the GCIC president. He added that all Christian organisations had condemned the killing of the Hindu leader, Swami Laxmanananda Saraswati, on Aug 23. They had been "totally dismayed" by the resulting onslaught against Christians, which is continuing in Orissa.

    While this was the worst hit area, other states like Karnataka, Tamil Nadu, Kerala and Madhya Pradesh also witnessed anti-Christian violence.

    Christians comprise around 2.5 per cent of India's total population of over 1.2 billion. Over 80 per cent of the country's people are Hindu.
    Tens of thousands of Christians are still living in refugee camps across Orissa. They are too frightened to return home even though violence has subsided over the past week. Hindu mobs have told survivors they will only be allowed to return home if they convert to Hinduism.

    The predominantly Hindu police have beena accused of aiding the violence by protecting the mobs and, in some cases, even joining them in the carnage.

    Manmohan Singh, the prime minister, has urged all politicians to "preserve and promote" India's "unique confluence of cultures" and end the communal violence.

    "We need to meet today's mindless violence with the requisite amount of force, but must also ensure that this is tempered by reason and justice which is the normal order of governance," he said.

    November 9, 2011 at 10:22 am | Reply
    • AcclaimedMan

      Not only your comment is simply a Porky RANT, but also off topic !!!

      Hindus are primarily responsible for holding the democracy in India, which is the largest ever in the whole world. Because of Hindus all religions (you name it) are co-habitats in India !!!

      While population of all religions in India increased since her independence, the same cannot be said about Porkystan, where all non-Islamic religions are systematically slaughtered over the last 63+ years and is still continued !!!

      November 9, 2011 at 12:18 pm | Reply
      • Real_World

        Isn't India better known as "Hindustain"? I rest my case. Democracy my a$$. Hindus in India have stripped Muslims, Jews and Christian men just to check if they were circumcised. Hindu's don't believe in hygiene and circumcision. It's mandatory for all Hindus to eat Cow Dung and have a shot of Urine to wash it down with. You guys are absolutely horrendous beings that stink like hell. Get the fuck out of the UK and the US. We don’t want you ugly critters here!!!!!

        November 9, 2011 at 12:51 pm |
      • monty

        Your a racist brat and need to learn basic skills of respecting all countries.

        Let me tell you that facts speak for themselves India is just a democracy in name and has always been disrespectful of all the minorities and this is a fact of life which all Indians must face.

        Your language indicates that this is a fact. What happened to Christians in Orissa. What happened to Silks in India. What happened to Muslims in Gujarat is also a fact and needs to be investigated by human right organizations. What has been done since 1989 farce elections in Kashmir is well known 80,000 innocent Kashmirs have been killed by the Indian security forces.

        Indians need to look into their glass house before accusing another country.

        Let me ask you a question India is a so-called secular country so why are you talking of Hindus when Hindu religion is not part of your constitution why you do not follow your constitution and think your self a Hindu and not an Indian first??

        November 9, 2011 at 6:25 pm |
      • AcclaimedMan

        Python,

        Your are useless uneducated brat, who not only disrespectful but also a terrorist. Straight talks do net get digested by you, only assault of any kind keeps you straight, and hence you and people like you, deserve my statement fully !!!

        Which part of my language hurt you most. Tell us and I will double that. But know well that facts hurt the guilty ones !!!

        November 9, 2011 at 10:15 pm |
    • AcclaimedMan

      Text books in Pakistani schools foster prejudice and intolerance of Hindus and other religious minorities, while most teachers view non-Muslims as "enemies of Islam," according to a study by a U.S. government commission released Wednesday.

      The study reviewed more than 100 textbooks from grades 1-10 from Pakistan's four provinces. Researchers in February this year visited 37 public schools, interviewing 277 students and teachers, and 19 madrases, where they interviewed 226 students and teachers.

      The Islamization of textbooks began under the U.S.-backed rule of army dictator Gen. Zia-ul-Haq, who courted Islamists to support his rule.

      The report found systematic negative portrayals of minorities, especially Hindus and, to a lesser extent, Christians. Hindus make up more than 1 percent of Pakistan's 180 million people, while Christians represent around 2 percent. Some estimates put the numbers higher.

      "Religious minorities are often portrayed as inferior or second-class citizens who have been granted limited rights and privileges by generous Pakistani Muslims, for which they should be grateful," the report said. "Hindus are repeatedly described as extremists and eternal enemies of Islam whose culture and society is based on injustice and cruelty, while Islam delivers a message of peace and brotherhood, concepts portrayed as alien to the Hindu."

      "In most cases historic revisionism seems designed to exonerate or glorify Islamic civilization, or to denigrate the civilizations of religious minorities," the report said. "Basic changes to the texts would be needed to present a history free of false or unsubstantiated claims which convey religious bias."

      Attempts to reach Pakistan's education minister were not successful.

      November 9, 2011 at 3:19 pm | Reply
    • AcclaimedMan

      Tell us one religion that Muslims go well with !!!

      November 9, 2011 at 3:21 pm | Reply
      • Real_World

        judaism and Christianity..... your turn. Name 1 hindu who doesn't stink like dog shit..

        November 9, 2011 at 3:52 pm |
      • AcclaimedMan

        None. Why? Because dog is trustworthy, unlike Porkies, who are all Pork shit eaters !!! ROFL at your pathetic state !!!

        November 9, 2011 at 10:17 pm |
      • Real_World

        your written communication skills are horrible. I guess what you mean is that all indians smell like Dog Shit and that's ok because because they are like the Dog God. How about your Pig God? Some of you people smell like pig ass. What's the story with that? BTW, stop laughing. We are laughing at you, not with you!!

        November 10, 2011 at 9:22 am |
      • AcclaimedMan

        You are right about what I meant, but still you failed to comprehend the severe admonition I have made through it. Poor Porkies, like you, have again failed to understand the indirect busting !!!

        November 10, 2011 at 10:50 am |
    • murphy

      You must be crazy number one or -i d i o t- number one to say this

      The only reply I can give you is that Minorities have more rights in India than majority community.

      If you want to believe this believe otherwise it is up to you.

      November 10, 2011 at 11:16 am | Reply
      • Real_World

        another dumb dot head. that's all you are.

        November 10, 2011 at 9:05 pm |
      • AcclaimedMan

        Porkies have the still the illusion of being the smartest, while the country is in a rapid path to self-destruction !!!

        It is good for the rest of the world, isn't it?

        November 13, 2011 at 5:31 pm |
  21. Pax

    Pakistan needs increased trade. Effort toward that goal will improve the situation for all parties. Containment is going to happen. Targeted sanctions are going to happen. Policies which derive from – and which are pursued with actions rooted in – integrity will reduce tensions and promote fair dealings. The deceitful nature of Pakistani politics notwithstanding, there is no way forward in Pakistan with its military in power. Trade empowers the elected government in three important ways, the first of which is the survival of the elected government while the military is defunded and downsized. The second and not less important is the strengthening of common-law jurisprudence through international regulatory pressures, which can begin the desperately overdue process of replacing corrupt and weak judges in Pakistan with a few who will deliver justice. The third is an employed population making decent progress in their daily lives, which starves fuel from the fires of extremist sentiment.

    M'kay? so...increase trade, cut off military aid, and work in earnest to build the Pak economy. After maybe 100 years, this will improve the situation enough to end terrorism, and bring US troops home from the Khorasan.

    If that seems laughable, then admit that we should just leave Afghanistan now, and not sweat the consequences. No matter what bad guys we kill, or how stable the security situation is 'assessed' as, things will go down to the low standards they were at before, after the ISAF withdraws. Nation-building in that part of the world is going to be a big disappointment for at least another century, maybe two.

    We have already accomplished all we are going to accomplish there with an army. Safe-havens for militants? For sale in Pakistan, in Iran, in Yemen, and going cheap. More terrorist attacks in the West? Yes, unless Islamic extremism is exterminated. When will the Islamic extremists be silenced? WHO THE FVCK CARES?!! Cave-dwelling fundamentalists do not build bridges or create jobs. They do not cure diseases or discover new technologies. The world that goes to work every day largely ignores them. The unemployed, and the wards of madrassas are their main audience.

    It will take a very long time for that smelly part of the world to grow an economy and get its birth rates under control. Meantime, we will have dealings with their cave-dwellers. Fun times, huh?

    November 9, 2011 at 10:18 am | Reply
  22. Amit-Atlanta-USA

    The picture depicts a rally addressed by Imran Khan the leader of the PTI. While Imran Khan and his young & educated Pakistanis (see pic) style themselves as moderates who are willing to start a dialogue with the west, if you examine their grievances closely it's no different from those of the Koranic foot soldiers fighting in the ravines of Af-Pak or even that of CNN's own Mr. FAREED ZAKARIA.

    [youtube=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L9fW9jPnjgE&w=640&h=390]

    November 8, 2011 at 8:53 pm | Reply
    • AccliamedMan

      It was like a fake story from Imarn about Islam, which we all know is violent and untrustworthy !!!

      November 13, 2011 at 3:32 am | Reply
  23. Real_World

    from Wikipedia:

    From 1964 to 1996, at least 38 incidents of violence against Christians were reported. In 1997, 24 such incidents were reported. Since 1998, Christians in India have faced a wave of violence.[4] In 1998 alone, 90 incidents were reported.[2]

    The Sangh Parivar and related organisations have stated that the violence is an expression of "spontaneous anger" of "vanvasis" against "forcible conversion" activities undertaken by missionaries,[2][5][6] a claim described as "absurd" and rejected by scholars.[2]

    Overview

    Incidents of violence against Christians have occurred in nearly all parts of India, it has largely been confined to north, central, and western India, in the states of Gujarat, Maharashtra, Uttar Pradesh, Madhya Pradesh, and the capital area of New Delhi

    In June 2000, four churches around India were bombed. In Andhra Pradesh, church graves were desecrated. A church in Maharashtra was ransacked.[2] In September 2008, two churches were partly damaged in Kerala.[7][8] Christian leaders described the events of September 2008 as deliberate acts by anti-socials and denied any religious motive in the attacks.[9]

    Karnataka
    Main article: Anti-Christian violence in Karnataka
    The 2008 wave of attacks against Christians in Karnataka includes attacks directed against Christian churches and prayer halls in Karnataka by the Bajrang Dal, with the ruling BJP government accused of involvement. The violence started from 14 September 2008 when about 20 churches were vandalized in Mangalore, Udupi, Chikkamagaluru, and in other districts of Karnataka. Minor violence was later reported from the border state of Kerala.

    Incidents of mob attacks against Jehovah’s Witnesses have been reported with increasing frequency in Karnataka. The attackers gather in gangs of 20 to 50 individuals to intimidate small groups of Witnesses engaging in the peaceful Christian ministry that they are well known for. Some of the mobs threaten to murder and rape the Witnesses.

    Orissa
    Main article: Religious violence in Orissa
    In a well-publicised case, Graham Staines, an Australian Christian missionary was burnt to death along with his two sons Timothy (aged 9) and Philip (aged 7), while they were sleeping in his station wagon at Manoharpur village in Keonjhar district in Orissa in January 1999. He was running the Evangelical Missionary Society of Mayurbhanj, an Australian missionary society.[3] His "distribution of beef & desecrating Hindu Deities" was the root cause of this attack. In [2003, Dara Singh was convicted of leading the gang responsible.[10]

    After Staines' murder, outbreak of violence started on 24 December 2007 at Bamunigam village of Kandhamal District. Some Hindu activists forcefully removed a Christmas decoration, put up on a site traditionally used by Hindus during Durga Puja.

    In August 2008, Swami Lakshmanananda, a Hindu monk and spiritual leader, was attacked and killed. The violence that followed resulted in the death of one Christian and two Hindus. The violence later spread to 300 villages in 14 of the 30 districts in the state, resulting in 4,400 burnt houses and 50,000 homeless. Fifty-nine people were killed, while 18,000 were injured.

    In 2011, the supreme court upheld a life sentence for Dara singh, court comments for the murder of Graham Staines and his two young children, stating that "the intention was to give a Graham Staines a less for his religious activities, and not to kill them, Many Christian leader concern about supreme courts comment and view it as ambiguous and dangerous because they seem to justify anti-Christian violence.

    [edit]Gujarat
    In 1997 in Gujarat, 22 churches were burnt or destroyed, and another 16 damaged.[2] Recently, there has been a sharp increase in violent attacks on Christians. A Hindu group claims to have converted 2,000 tribal Christians to Hinduism. The attackers had vandalized places of worship and thus caused strike terror among the tribals. On 18 September, the Central Government issued an advisory under Article 355 of the constitution to the Orissa government along with Karnataka.[11][12]

    [edit]Politics

    Vishva Hindu Parishad (VHP), Bajrang Dal, and Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sangh are the most accused Hindu organizations for violence against Christians in India.[3] Sangh Parivar and local media were involved in promoting anti-Christian propaganda in Gujrat.[3] It is evident from the ruling BJP governments in Gujarat, Orissa and Karnataka that serious lapses in handling the violence against minorities as the police failed to solve the issue effectively and the BJP was found directly responsible for allowing bloodshed to spread.[13][14]

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Christian_violence_in_India

    November 8, 2011 at 6:34 pm | Reply
    • Amit-Atlanta-USA

      The NOTE IN BOLD with an exclamatory mark says this

      ! THIS ARTICLE NEEDS ATTENTION FROM AN EXPERT ON THE SUBJECT. See the talk page for details. Consider associating this request with a WikiProject. (March 2010).

      There are charges that this page was a stub put in by ISLAMISTS in India to drive a wedge between Hindus & Christians.

      November 8, 2011 at 8:29 pm | Reply
    • AcclaimedMan

      Do you know in each of these cases Indian justice system has punished the culprits?

      Can you say the same thing about Porkystan, where OBL was found and killed where as all Porkies as well as their government was in a state of consistent denials?

      No you can't but rather throw some usual rants, just like your other Porky siblings do !!!

      You are a FFOOOOLLIISSHH !!!

      November 9, 2011 at 12:23 pm | Reply
      • monty

        Don't be a liar has India punished Chief Minister Modi the criminal who is 100% responsible for killing 2,000 Muslims in Gujarat???

        Think objectively and face facts and you will be disappointed how you treated all the minorities no matter what you say or write here.

        November 9, 2011 at 6:30 pm |
      • AcclaimedMan

        Now you are you are fully a Monty Python !!!

        After Mumbai 2008 event, any Indian will be ready to duplicate Modi, if at all you think he killed many Muslims, to exterminate all Porky pests like you !!!

        November 9, 2011 at 10:21 pm |
    • kris

      practice your religion and try not to convert people to christianity It is that simple You will be left alone and no body will bother you in your church and please do not keep quoting chistians being attacked in India it happens in good old Pakistan also

      November 15, 2011 at 3:16 pm | Reply
  24. Amit-Atlanta-USA

    I reproduce below a highly though provoking, factual response from Mr.Michael Steele on the WSJ dated Sept 28th 2011 regarding Ad.Mullen's comments on the Haqqani Terrorists calling them a veritable arm of the Pakistani ISI & Govt.

    PLEASE READ THIS FULLY

    Regarding your “How Pakistan Lost Its Top US Friend”, (Barnes and Entous article, 28 Sep 2011), both your article and Adm Mullen exemplify the fundamental naivety and failure of US foreign policy from Rabat to Rawalpindi for the last hundred years. I have grieved over the dearth of Mid-East and Islamic expertise evinced in successive presidential administrations since WW-II.

    Our entire foreign policy with this part of the world has been based on totally naive and unrealistic assumptions. It has been founded in our own culture’s axioms and assumptions when dealing with European friends and adversaries, with no regard for the Muslim world’s or Eastern world’s view of us and what drives how they deal with us. In short, Muslim dealings with the West, and the US in particular, have been laced with duplicity and deceit. Rarely do Muslim countries ever see us as more than an expedient association and never a true friend.

    There are many good works on Arab and Islamic culture available, but most any graduate of the US Army, Defense Language Institute-Foreign Language Center (DLI-FLC), at the Presidio of Monterey, CA, and the US Army’s Mid-East Psychological Operations School, at the JFK Special Warfare Center (JFK-SWC), Fort Bragg, North Carolina, will tell you that, when dealing with Muslims, everyone should begin with completely digesting and studying the Quran and reading Rapael Patai’s, “The Arab Mind”, (Scribner’s & Sons, New York, 1973, 1976 & 1983).

    Religion is a core value. Any psychological warfare specialist will tell you to never attempt to assault or change the core values of a target audience, because you will immediately alienate your audience, lose all credibility and instill deep distrust. So what do our White House, Congress and State Department do? They tell the world and Muslims that they must change ancient cultural practices; publicly calling them barbaric (which they are), causing them to lose face and creating deep distrust, antipathy and hatred.

    Furthermore, Muslims see us as interlopers at best, but predominantly as blood enemies of Islam. In deed the West’s history and rhetoric underscores that belief. The word “infidel” has been bandied about for so long in everyone’s description of how Muslims view us, that the word has lost its true impact as borne in the Muslim mind. An infidel to a Muslim is like the “Anti-Christ” is to Christians. We are Beelzebub incarnate.

    Muslims also have a long history of dealing with the world from a weaker and/or impoverished position, particularly the Shia. Muslims, have also, usually been caught between contending powers and/or external and internal rivalries. Coupled with Quranic permission to lie to and to deceive infidels, Muslims have long understood and practiced telling the West what it wants to hear, and living up to their words, only when it was expedient or advantageous. Meanwhile, they are busy behind the scenes mending fences and paying off internal or regional hard-liners and fundamentalists and our enemies. One must always remember that lying is an art form in the Muslim world. Examples are everywhere throughout our history with them. Yet we are always surprised, astounded and jilted, when Muslim deceit and duplicity is outed.

    Our failures in the Muslim world will only continue and exacerbate until the White House and State Department get rid of the starry-eyed liberals who, like Adm Mullen, tragically and ignorantly treat, hearts a twitter, with Muslims as if we share common values and views. To succeed, we must employ hard-bitten and pragmatic people with true, unvarnished knowledge and understanding of Arab and S.W. Asian Muslims.

    Respectfully,
    Mike and Robyn Steele
    Midway, Georgia

    November 8, 2011 at 3:33 pm | Reply
  25. Amit-Atlanta-USA

    Here’s an ABSOLUTELY GREAT “MUST WATCH” video from a well known Astrologist PREDICTING way back in 2009 the INEVITABLE GREAT CLASH between AMERICA & PAKISTAN in 2012 leading to the DESTRUCTION OF THE PAKISTANI STATE!!!

    Even though I am myself deeply skeptical about astrological predictions, it’s ASTOUNDING to see how this ASTROLOGIST analyzes the unfolding sequence of events dwelling on both THE PAKISTANI PSYCHE (of DECIET & GREED) with the astrological line up for the Pakistani state. If we look at the EVENTS UNFOLDING RIGHT NOW we can very well see JUST HOW ACCURATE THE PREDICTIONS SEEM!!

    http://www. youtube. com/watch?v=oYymPzrnK5g

    November 8, 2011 at 3:18 pm | Reply
    • Amit-Atlanta-USA

      [youtube=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYymPzrnK5g&w=640&h=390]

      November 8, 2011 at 3:21 pm | Reply
    • Real_World

      Thanks Dot head

      November 8, 2011 at 5:29 pm | Reply
    • MInto

      Accurate prediction by an Indian about Pakistan???

      What a jaundiced and prejudiced mind you are!!

      Better improve your thinking then just thinking about destruction of Pakistan. As Economically the so- called 1st world country are going down so quickly and need to save themselves before thinking of a small third world country like Pakistan which is fighting a war against Taliban itself.

      November 9, 2011 at 2:26 am | Reply
  26. Haroon

    The author of this article, Mr. Dhume accuses China of being 'authoritarian'. Yet, he identifies the core disputed territory of disputed Jammu & Kashmir as 'obselete' and as 'absolutely Indian'. Are you a joker sir? Typical Indian mentality. We must always drag our feet with regard to India, no matter what.

    November 8, 2011 at 3:07 pm | Reply
  27. Amit-Atlanta-USA

    I am tired of writing on this subject.

    So I just say this:

    ENGAGED (Endlessly!) – If our ultimate aim is to COMMIT SUICIDE

    CONTAINED – If we are serious about RIDDING THE FREE WORLD of Pak inspired terror, and eliminate the threat of their ISLAMIC BOMB!

    November 8, 2011 at 3:04 pm | Reply
    • Amit-Atlanta-USA

      Check out the following and decide for yourselves whether to contain or engage Pakistan:

      PAKISTAN-THE ALLY FROM HELL-TheAtlantic.com 11-04-11 ABSOLUTELY GREATEST
      http://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2011/11/the-atlantic-cover-story-pakistan-the-ally-from-hell/247886/

      AMERICA and the ISLAMIC BOMB – THE DEADLY COMPROMISE by David Armstrong
      http://books.google.com/books?id=b28qAAAAYAAJ&q=america+and+the+ISLAMIC+BOMB&dq=america+and+the+ISLAMIC+BOMB&hl=en&ei=i4y5Tv_AEc6atwey0ZnKBw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CC8Q6AEwAA

      AMERICA ALONE – THE END OF THE WORLD AS WE SEE IT by Mark Steyn
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/America_Alone

      November 8, 2011 at 3:12 pm | Reply
    • MInto

      India is a free country??? where the minorities are not exploited and marginalized what are you talking about.

      People living in glass houses should not throw stones.Look at the facts and not what the biased individuals who does not seem to look real facts but his own prejudice. Whats is happening in India as it blinded by the prejudice against Pakistan and its people and pretending to be real Americans while their minds are blinded by their hatred against Pakistan and its people.

      India is a 16 separatists movements in your country, show your true face what you did to the Christians, Muslims, lower casts, silks and other minorities and with the Kashmirs in particular and the real face of Indian freedom will come in front of the real free world.

      Please stop the prejudice against Pakistan and also look at your own actions and your countries as their are problems in your countries that are also as serious so better look at them as well and no need to exaggerate problems in Pakistan because your biased against them.

      November 9, 2011 at 1:32 am | Reply
      • AcclaimedMan

        Do you realize you are a minority from where you are posting these idiotic comments? You are a minority to that extent that your name itself is sufficient ring alarm bells and you are looked at with serious suspicion !!!

        November 9, 2011 at 10:24 pm |
  28. nick

    There is no comparison between India and Pakistan....every one knows that India has more poor people than any country...but still it is one of fastest developing country in the world...no one can deny this....may be in coming years poor people percentage will come down in India......where as pakistan is going down day by day.....you can see the graph of its currency....soon pakistan is going to become history.....it doesn't need any outsiders to collapse their own economy...they will dig their own grave....as we can see that from past several years .....

    November 8, 2011 at 2:16 pm | Reply
    • Amit-Atlanta-USA

      Well Said!

      Check out my responses above if you wish.

      November 8, 2011 at 11:06 pm | Reply
    • MInto

      Well your evil views about Pakistan are totally unwarranted as Pakistan is fighting against the evil of the Taliban.

      While have you visited Pakistan and India so better visit both countries and you can then compare both countries which country has more poverty in spite of that Pakistan is fighting the war for the last 10 years.

      Please depend on just reading the western media and adopt their prejudices against Pakistan and just write here without thinking your self.

      November 9, 2011 at 1:56 am | Reply
      • Amit-Atlanta-USA

        Dear Pakistani Friend Mlnto:

        This guy is a well know US astrologist who is looking at this from a US-Pak perspective and has nothing to do with India.

        November 9, 2011 at 9:21 am |
      • AcclaimedMan

        But Pinto, The Joker, got carried away !!! ROFL !!!

        November 9, 2011 at 10:25 pm |
    • krm1007

      The Multidimensional Poverty Index developed by Oxford University shows that India is far poorer than Africa not just in number but also in intensity.
      The new poverty measure shows that 8 states out of the 29 states in India have more poor people than 26 poorest African countries combined. The Multidimensional poverty index views poverty from several different angles instead of just GDP figures. India is crippled by so many problems. For example, India's population growth rate is increasing by the day putting pressure on the limited resources and leaving many Indians in absolute poverty. India is very poor in terms of education, in terms of economic improvement, infrastructure, heath care, etc.

      November 10, 2011 at 7:54 pm | Reply
  29. t

    Send no more money to Pakistan. Tell Pakistan thanks but no thanks. Recall our ambassador and staff from Pakistan and close down our embassy there. Expel the Pakistani ambassador and the staff from the US. It is over.

    November 8, 2011 at 11:41 am | Reply
    • MInto

      Well then how is NATO going to fight the war in Afghanistan as its a land locked country where you cannot send any supplies through other countries as its not practical.Pakistan provides the landlocked country 75% of its supplies which is the only port which can be practically be used.!!!!

      USA needs Pakistan more than Pakistan needs USA right now for your kind information.

      So please read the geography of the area before writing out of your hat over here!!!

      November 9, 2011 at 2:03 am | Reply
  30. Haroon

    I think the next American president ought to focus more on preventing his country ending up like the Soviet Union and less time on 'containment' of Pakistan. The declining livelihood of the American People should be the #1 priority of the American president. If you try to isolate Pakistan, we will only move closer to China. Russia is there too and wants to expand relations with us. We can easily live without America as an ally. You betrayed after the war in Afghanistan when we put our body and soul to fight the Soviet Union. You awarded us with Pressler Amendment for our commitment to the resistance in the 1980's in Afghanistan against the Soviet Union. In fact, without us, you would have never delivered the Soviet Union its own Vietnam.

    While you can talk big and huff and puff about punishing Pakistan, know that we 200 million strong and all we have to do is open up our ports to Russian investment and that alone will meet the shortfall of American 'aid'.

    LONG LIVE CHINA!

    November 8, 2011 at 8:21 am | Reply
    • Ismaili girl

      yawwwwwwwwn ..

      November 8, 2011 at 9:49 am | Reply
    • Real_World

      the stinky Indians are yawning. Maybe if they took a bath with soap rather than cow dung and drank water rather than their own urine, they might not be considered the armpit of the world.

      November 8, 2011 at 11:19 am | Reply
    • krm1007

      Pakistan’s WMD Assets keep the neighbors and the world awake by its mere military sybmolism both defensive and offensive. Therein lies its beauty as a deterrent. The delivery system also has been perfected by Pakistan for medium range conflict which includes a 1500+ mile range. Current focus is on rapid deployment with MIRMs. One can draw his or her own conclusions by looking at a map.This strategy has enabled Pakistan to emerge and coronate itself as a regional military power in West Central Asia virtually without any competition. And that is the frustration of world powers these days as they can do nothing about it except for CNN propaganda.This too will be countered shortly. Stay tuned for more.

      November 10, 2011 at 7:55 pm | Reply
    • Fred Phred

      I've got news for you. Neither China nor Russia have any plans to invest in Pakistan. It's too much of a disaster, and the money is just stolen by corrupt people. For every $100 of investment, you would only see a $15 return.

      But you can hope someone else becomes your sugar-daddy because you lost yours. Because you couldn't decide whether to side with your violent fellow muslims or try to clean up the country and move forward into the 20th centrury.

      You made your bed. Good luck with that.

      November 11, 2011 at 6:46 pm | Reply
  31. AJ

    I hope and pray for the strong Pakistan and U.S relationship. I do want to tell you friends, do not estimate on small group or number of people. Ask your self the other people are human being like you are, they want to live , happy, get education, don't limit your concept of living just o be a liberal person. Let's bring peace and brotherhood in world. There is no Pakistani American Britain or etc everyone is same.
    Thanks

    November 8, 2011 at 8:21 am | Reply
    • mia ghantewala

      Just took a mad shiat

      November 8, 2011 at 9:50 am | Reply
  32. Peter C. Huang

    !. The aid to Pakistan a year around $1.5 billion is rather the reward to its logistic supply line, from sea to Pakistan then by supply convoy into allies in Afghan and need the Pakistan military to help, than for other term.
    2. As Pakistani powerful military is hooked with its government, to play against its military is tantamount to be against its government. That is why China can speak for Pakistan that if Pakistan is attacked by USA it is equal to that of China.
    3. For 30 years Afghan has been 4 million refuges in Pakistan relying on the latter to host. The so-called the Taliban's offensive into Afghan against allies from Pakistan is fanfared by Pakistan is not true. Rather it is caused by the refuges wanting to go back to their homeland.
    4. The USA wants bombing the refuges in Pakistan would cause disaster not only the refuges but also Pakistani residents that is why the USA's initiative is not welcome by both Afghan and Pakistani, and causing Afghan President Karzie to say if the refuges are bombarded Afghan will help Pakistan to ward off that action.
    5. Why the USA can not play gain-and-give to be balance to both Pakistan and Afghan to win them as ameable allies, instead of step by step playing sacifice but getting no merit?

    Reply

    November 8, 2011 at 6:24 am | Reply
  33. billybob22

    Pakistan hates the US. All they want us to do is eat Pizza all day long and go to Chinese ninja films. I personally think that the Pakistanis are secret Zombies who want to eat us all after pretendiing that they are our allies. Nothing could be further from the truth. They are NOT our allies! Pakistan is Bad. America is Good.

    November 8, 2011 at 6:13 am | Reply
  34. kpunniya

    In politics or Sports or anything pakistanies cannot be trusted. They say something and they do something. We have many past experiences. Pakistanies are Taliban, Alhyda ,Mujahidines and all trouble makers. Now look Indians are also copy down the same pattern. There is no God for these peoples. But they mention GOD all the time but in reality all are fake.

    November 8, 2011 at 4:30 am | Reply
    • billybob22

      I say we bring them all a present and deliver them unto their god without fanfare.......just BOOM!!!!!

      November 8, 2011 at 5:18 am | Reply
      • MInto

        Perhaps protect your own economic well being as who so ever entered this region whether it be Britain, USSR or even Alexander was destroyed this is history so don't be so haughty and leave this region alone so you can survive the economic tsunami which is showing its face in this part of the world while your blinded by hatred of Pakistan.

        November 9, 2011 at 2:12 am |
    • MInto

      35,000 Pakistanis have been killed in this so- called war on terror and they are fake and they are not human beings while only western people people are human beings according to you!!!

      Man you are the biggest racist if you think so!!

      November 9, 2011 at 2:07 am | Reply
  35. UkGirl

    Pakistanies name just gives me shivers .. ewwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww sick looking smelly pple

    70 year old men always marrying 17 or 18 year old girls

    or siblings marrying each other

    just sick sick sick disguting nation with filthy pple

    November 8, 2011 at 12:47 am | Reply
    • Atlantan

      None of what you said is true.

      November 8, 2011 at 2:04 am | Reply
      • billybob22

        If you are a Paki you are to be exterminated. We are coming for you. Sell your wife, whore your daughter, we will be there to administer a substantial dose of boom to your heads

        November 8, 2011 at 2:42 am |
    • AJ

      Well you probably met some British born girl, you are stinky and smelly by just using lotion and par fum to hide the smell of you doesn't make you superior. Let's not discuss the small group of people anywhere in the world does crazy things, It sounds like you have no believe you are completely lost. I hope you will understand my point. I am sure you won't be happy by reading this, so don't try to describe other people in that manner which you have done it. thanks

      November 8, 2011 at 8:17 am | Reply
    • MInto

      Which world are you living in??? Have you ever visited Pakistan?

      Whatever these innocent people read in the biased western press they believe that.

      This is very sad as the so-called Islamic extremists are hardly 0.0001% of the total population of Pakistan and living in 1% of the area of Pakistan who were driven by the NATO forces in 2001 when the left most of their forces to Iraq so who is to blame.

      Please come and visit Pakistan and see what kind of marriages take place and nobody marries kids or their own family,

      This is rubbish your writing against Pakistan based on your ill information and personal prejudice and need to improve your language skills and your fascist attitude.

      This is one of the great problems that people who have never ever visited Pakistan seem to write as they are the most knowledgeable about Pakistan!!

      November 9, 2011 at 1:43 am | Reply
      • AcclaimedMan

        Can't take it, isn't it, you Porky?

        Truth hurts and we are willing to go more than just hurting by words !!!

        November 9, 2011 at 10:27 pm |
      • kris

        That is correct All the muslims from mid east go to india to buy 9 yr old brides

        November 15, 2011 at 3:31 pm |
  36. PAK IS SATAN

    Pakistan

    sold its pple to america

    sold their land to china

    sold their soul to Taliban

    cricket players sold their country to Indian bookies

    women to Arabs and Indians

    Pakistanies sell ther wives for men for bisexual sex

    pakistan is rated 1 for beastialty

    pakistanies are known to sell mothers and sisters for money

    November 8, 2011 at 12:43 am | Reply
    • MInto

      Well you may have sold your mother and sister to others as no sensible person can do that or does so in Pakistan.

      You seem to be an evil person writing something so evil about Pakistan which never exists when you don't know anything against Pakistan therefore you need to educate your self about Pakistan before writing her and be careful in writing and improving your personality, language skills and being less of a fascist and being so prejudiced and racist.

      Your fascist letter is being published here by CNN which indicates that the real loss in quality of the western media itself which is disappointing in itself.

      November 9, 2011 at 1:50 am | Reply
  37. Ahmadi

    Pakistanies are biggest traitors ..they were traitors of India ..

    pakistanies kill minorities like ahmadias, hindus and sikhs

    pakistanies blow schools and buses

    pakistanies blow bazaars

    shias kill sunnies

    sunnies kill shias

    in last 3 months 7000 pakistanies killed each other on religion basis

    what a fvking nation ..

    dil dil pakistan
    abbu gandu ammi rand

    November 8, 2011 at 12:38 am | Reply
  38. billybob22

    Pakistan is our enemy. They have demonstrated this to us many many times. They should be treated as hostile.

    November 7, 2011 at 11:49 pm | Reply
    • MInto

      You people are your own greatest enemy. Your fighting a war that you cannot win and bombing people and killing civilians in that region making enemies of unconcerned people while your country is dying economically so do not think that Pakistani people are your enemies as they want you to stop killing them without reason.

      You should not write stupid things as Pakistan is fighting the war on terror while your hatred for Pakistan is not based on facts as your ignorance know no boundaries for which I am sad but I can only advise you to read about Pakistan and visit Pakistan to improve your knowledge about Pakistan and not depend up on the biased western media.

      November 9, 2011 at 2:19 am | Reply
      • billybob22

        You are an idiot. I am going to get a hanky for you. Why don'tyou and your turban visit the US? We will be waiting for you

        November 10, 2011 at 2:19 am |
  39. Riaz Haq

    Here are some recent quotes from Republican Presidential hopeful Ron Paul on the follies of American policy in Pakistan:

    "Sometimes they miss and sometimes there's collateral damage. And every time we do that, we develop more enemies."

    "We're dropping a lot of drone missile/bombs in Pakistan and claim we've killed so many, but how about the innocent people [who have] died? Nobody hears about that. This is why the people of Pakistan can't stand our guts and why they disapprove of their own government."

    "We're bombing Pakistan and trying to kill some people, making a lot of mistakes, building up our enemies, at the same time we're giving billions of dollars to the government of Pakistan.. We're more or less inciting a civil war there, so I think that makes us less safe."

    "For everyone you kill, you probably create 10 new people who hate our guts and would like to do us harm."

    November 7, 2011 at 10:50 pm | Reply
    • Fred Phred

      And the alternative is? We just let them be like we did before 9/11 and let them come kill us? Is that REALLY your solution? NOT an option my friend.

      Look nobody likes the killing of innocents (except muslim extremists – they seem to like it) but until you have a better idea, this is the best we've got. We can no longer afford to disregard terrorists. So if you live near a terrorist – move. If you live with a terrorist – move. If you know a terrorist – turn him in. These are all good ideas that you can do to help avoid these issues.

      Let me know how you're proceeding.

      November 11, 2011 at 6:58 pm | Reply
  40. Riaz Haq

    Let's all learn from history. I believe Pakistanis have learned from their mistake of complying with US demands to replicate all of America's mistakes in the region every step of the way since the 1980s when Haqqanis were called "moral equivalents of America's founding fathers" by President Reagan. The best thing for US and Pakistan now is to listen to each other as partners and work as partners to avoid the mistakes of the past that could doom both.

    November 7, 2011 at 7:34 pm | Reply
  41. Real_World

    I'm not a racist, but we used to chant this as kids " Hindu Hindu over there.... Where did you get that greasy hair"... over and over again. We haven't gotten an answer yet!!

    November 7, 2011 at 6:46 pm | Reply
    • rk from US

      look out !!!! there a Drone over your head !!!!!!!!!!!

      November 7, 2011 at 6:59 pm | Reply
      • Real_World

        I wish a drone would give me head.. lmao... by the way, does RK = Radakrishna?

        November 7, 2011 at 7:10 pm |
    • Mark

      Real_World is a Pakistani in disguise ! Looks like a ISI agent ! Hunt these terrorist to the end of the World.

      November 7, 2011 at 7:50 pm | Reply
      • Real_World

        Thanks for pointing that out "Mark"... btw, when did you get your H1 visa?

        November 7, 2011 at 7:56 pm |
      • MInto

        And your a Indian RAW agent pretending to be an American so better shed off your mask and show how deceitful you are yourself.

        November 9, 2011 at 1:15 am |
  42. krm1007

    People. fight your own battles......Pakistan is not going to fight it for you. US spends $200,000 per soldier on figthing th eTalibans in Afghanistan and expects Pakistan to spend $2000. Not going to happen anymore on the cheap. Pakistan has already won the Viet Nam war for USA when it kicked out the Soviets in Afghanistan at a tremendous cost to its people...trillions of $ spent by Pakistan out of pocket, hundreds of thousands Pakistanis have laid down their lives, Pakistan has hosted over 4 million Afghan refugees on its land for the past 30 years...NO MORE...ENOUGH IS ENOUGH...USA and NATO can find their own wars.....Pakistanis will do whatever is in their country's interests....PERIOD.

    November 7, 2011 at 6:26 pm | Reply
  43. We Support Imran Khan

    I am not interested in this Anti-Pakistan article however I liked the picture of these Imran Khan supporters. Quite a good looking crowd. Lion Imran Khan & Pakistan Tehreek Insaaf Rules!

    November 7, 2011 at 5:51 pm | Reply
  44. krm1007

    Neither. But....
    PAKISTAN.....The New Gateway to Central Asia and Europe.

    With a population of over 180 million most of whom are well educated, english speaking, entrepreneurial, a cultural and social fit with Central Asians...Pakistan will now become the new face and gateway to Central Asia and Europe. Pakistan will thus span this region and provide the impetus for growth, prosperity and unity among these countries. These are new and exciting times for Pakistanis who should now look forward to their new leadership role aligned with Central Asia and Europe rather than the Subcontinent. We wish them much success as they have sacrificed the most during the past 30 + years creating a new world order.

    November 7, 2011 at 5:48 pm | Reply
    • rk from US

      where did you buy your tin foil hat ?????????????

      November 7, 2011 at 7:00 pm | Reply
      • Real_World

        I guess China....

        November 7, 2011 at 7:11 pm |
  45. Clinton

    Pakistan, like many Muslim nations is a Country that can't be trusted. They are a people that have no problem lying to the world, declaring that they are a peaceful loving society, but at the very same time supporting terrorists that detonate bombs on civilian targets.... The US would be best served by simply leaving this region of the world, they will end up at War with India anyways... Let the Indians annihilate that country... Seriously... Lying deceitful people.

    November 7, 2011 at 5:15 pm | Reply
    • Real_World

      and maybe we should take great pleasure in watching China twist India into a pretzel. Clinton, or is it Hari Krishna? relax. We don't want 2 strategic 3rd world allies blow each other up. Let's try to find a sensible solution. How about we throw some deoderant and toothpaste over both nations to see which country adapts to western society quicker?

      November 7, 2011 at 5:23 pm | Reply
    • krm1007

      BODDA BING BODDA BOOM

      We are Hindus from India,
      And we like to put on the Bindiya,
      We are mostly Haris,
      But we like to put on the Saris,
      Sadly, we are nothing but Bhikaris,
      Sadly, we are nothing but Bhikaris,
      We take the Americans to Heart,
      But get nothing in return except a F@rt,
      So we tend to kiss the American @ss,
      Again, we get nothing in return except the American gas,
      Sadly we are nothing but Bhikaris nothing but Bhikaris.

      November 7, 2011 at 5:49 pm | Reply
    • MInto

      If India had the courage to destroy and annihilate Pakistan they would have done that long ago. They are trying other deceitful means like the one used by Clinton who is a Pakistani hater Indian and pretending to be an American.

      Pakistan is a nuclear power so every country is scared shit that they will also be annihilated which tries to attack Pakistan.

      So just being a paper tiger is not enough as that is not possible as this is not a joke now so better keep quiet!!!

      November 9, 2011 at 1:12 am | Reply
  46. Real_World

    Wow. So we are going to rely on an Indian to tell us how to deal with Pakistan when they haven't figured out how to do so since 1947?

    November 7, 2011 at 5:10 pm | Reply
  47. Face it

    Indians are born Anti-Pakistan therefore this article makes no sense. India is always jealous that Pakistan is progressing beyond their imaginations. I do not think Pakistan should have any ties with these Indians. Pakistan is always going to be at war with these ignorant people.

    November 7, 2011 at 4:25 pm | Reply
    • Clinton

      Ahhhahahahahahahaha – What a dumb post from someone who is obviously of pakistani origins. India is far more advanced than Pakistan, and has a much better economy than Pakistan does too... it's pathetic to hear imbeciles try to act like they're providing insight when all they want is to state their agenda.... I guarantee you if conventional war broke out between Pakistan and India on a grand scale, India would mop the floor with Pakistan.

      November 7, 2011 at 5:04 pm | Reply
      • Real_World

        India should export all of its AIDS patients to Pakistan. That might work better than comparing d**k sizes..

        November 7, 2011 at 5:14 pm |
      • Clinton

        I'm just looking at it realistically, we all know Pakistan is a country that can't even decide if it's a military dictatorship or a quazi-democratic society... either way you can't trust that country at this point in time, they both support and attack Terrorists depending on which ones they are... and who benefits them the most... It's not a stable country... India on the other hand has made it's way into the world economy and is becoming an economic powerhouse... i'm just stating the obvious... India would mop the floor with Pakistan.

        November 7, 2011 at 5:18 pm |
      • Let the Monkeys scream

        India is 10 times larger than Pakistan and second most populated country in the world and 60% of Indians live in slums who cannot afford a glass of water. "According to World Bank’s latest estimates on global poverty India is home to roughly one-third of total poor in the world. It also has the highest percentage of people living on less than $2 per day which is far lower than people living in Sub-Saharan Africa. " Imagine if the war broke out with Pakistan. India wont be able to afford to go to war with Pakistan. Not to mention Pakistan being a nuclear power now with more nuclear heads than France. It would be a lose lose situation for India always.

        November 7, 2011 at 5:29 pm |
      • Say the Truth

        India is the main hub of the terrorism. You cannot count the daily terrorist attacks in India every day. The number is so big and these attacks are carried out by Non Muslim separatist movements who wants independence from India. Indian media channels completely cover up these daily terrorism activities. There are over 300 different separatist movements in India, with the overwhelming majority being in the Northeast. Here is the Link http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Separatist_movements_of_India. Even in Canada a group called Khalistaan movement(Sikhs) wants Independence from India. This group is quite organized in terms of their activities against Indian government.

        November 7, 2011 at 5:42 pm |
      • Clinton

        Let the Monkey's Scream –
        I was reading your post and half way interested in your statistics until i read the part where you said Pakistan has more nukes than France and i couldn't help but laugh... The United States has the laregest stockpile of Nuclear Weapons in the world, second is Russia, and believe it or not 3rd is France. You lost all credibility after that.

        November 7, 2011 at 6:53 pm |
      • MInto

        Well India is such a heaven why are you pretending to be an American and why did you run away from India and settle here in USA???

        November 9, 2011 at 1:05 am |
    • krm1007

      LIPSTICK ON A PIG: The Story Of India

      Mirror Mirror on the Wall.....show the Indian Hindus who is the slimiest of them all.
      The way you let the shadows play
      You’d think my hair was getting gray.
      What’s that, you say? A double chin?
      No, that’s the way the light comes in.

      Self Denial …Self Denial…. Is the Hindu play.
      Maybe catharsis is another way

      November 7, 2011 at 5:50 pm | Reply
      • Real_World

        lol...too funny. Hold on, lemme bless the Mic with some Cow Dung.

        November 7, 2011 at 6:44 pm |
      • Clinton

        Wow, way to prove your arroghant racism to the world. Do you pick and choose which races you hate or do you pretty much hate everybody that doesn't look like yourself?

        November 7, 2011 at 7:07 pm |
  48. Jason

    We should do whats in our best interest not what some Indian is advocating for. From the article, "The main idea: target Pakistan's recalcitrant military while sparing its civilian population and continuing to strengthen Pakistan's fledgling democracy." How is this going to help bring some sort Reconciliation in Afghanistan and help us leave Afghanistan? We need to redouble our engage with the Pakistani Army to accomplish our goals in Afghanistan. Putting Sanctions on the Pakistani Army only helps india's interest which is clearly what the author is advocating for.

    The Pakistani army is far more popular than the civilian govt. hence putting sanctions on the army will only weaken the govt. and increase the army standing in Pakistan. We tried sanctions in the past and most policy makers have said it was a mistake. Do we want to repeat this mistake?

    November 7, 2011 at 4:08 pm | Reply
    • Clinton

      Huh? wait a minute Jason, you're saying we need to support the Pakistani military that has failed to go after the Taliban that are in their own country, staging and launching attacks and supporting fighters in Afghanistan? How does that make sense. I personally think we need to find a new ally in the war on terror, basically Pakistan is a two faced country with it's own agenda. They could give 2 !@#$'s if we take down Al Quaeda, they want us to be stuck in Afghan for decades because they get paid by the US as long as we're there... Pakistan is allowing the war to continue purposely propping up and allowing Al Quaeda to flourish within it's own borders so it can say it needs more money to fight them... Personally, I say we either find a new partner in the middle east or simply pull out of Afghanistan. Turn this war into an intelligence / special ops war. Fly into the region and bomb the hell out of any training camps or terrorist leaders compounds whenever we learn of them .... but forget Pakistan, they are a greedy good for nothing country that supports terrorism more than anything.

      November 7, 2011 at 5:10 pm | Reply
      • Jason

        I thought what i wrote was clear apparently you didn't comprehend what wrote. Claims about double games and triple games is not going to solve the afghan conflict. We need remove india from the equation and engage the pakistanis on afghanistan to resolve the conflict there.

        November 8, 2011 at 12:20 am |
    • krm1007

      GOD BLESS PAKISTAN,
      Land that we love.
      Stand beside her, and guide her
      Thru the night with a light from above.
      From Kashmir to Karachi and onto New Delhi,
      And to the oceans, white with foam
      GOD BLESS PAKISTAN, Our home sweet home.

      November 7, 2011 at 5:51 pm | Reply
      • OMG

        I guess those who want to close their eyes and ears and only listen to what they hear from the people who want to spread terror in the world will wish such a thing. Blessing Pakistan and include parts of India in it and then do what. Kill more people and make more terrorists. You must be crazy to wish this. I wish people of Pakistan can open their ears and eyes and for once look at the world. Pakistan means “Pure Place”. Not sure which part of this country is pure. Not the political leaders, not the military, not the religious leaders. Who suffers, only the ordinary, poor people of Pakistan and whole of the world as such.
        If you really love Pakistan so much as you write, maybe you should open your eyes and see what is wrong. Blaming India and other countries is not going to help your country.

        November 11, 2011 at 6:32 pm |
    • peter

      remember when the Iranians took over the US embassy? Remember that the Pakistanis stormed our embassy also? Our staff had to be helicoptered out! Pakistan has shownthat they cannot be engaged with anymore than the French and English could engage the nazis. Oh, they did engage the nazis, how'd that turn out?

      November 8, 2011 at 6:51 pm | Reply
  49. outspoken

    This guy is poorly educated about the foreign affairs. He does need to study a little bit more.

    November 7, 2011 at 4:07 pm | Reply
  50. outspoken

    Is USA becoming a war monger nation ??

    November 7, 2011 at 4:06 pm | Reply
  51. Czar1

    The author is an indian with anti-pakistan agenda. This is nothing new, these people always find their way in to US media to push pro-indian agenda. Wolf in the sheep's skin.

    Now moving on to this half article or should I say propaganda piece. US can not be that naive to fall for Pakistan's double game strategy as author describes. There is give and take in this relationship just like with anything else. US does conduct drone strikes almost daily with tacit approval of Pakistani governement. So Pakistan pays price in a diffrent way then the aid it receives from the US for providing supply lines for coalition forces.

    November 7, 2011 at 3:22 pm | Reply
    • krm1007

      We all know the dirty games India is playing in the region...financing terrorists who are killing US/NATO/Pakistani troops ....undermining democracies, paying off some factions of talibans protection money so they won't do another Mumbai attack, All this because they are scared of Al Qaeda and Talibans. INDIANS....we dare you to stop hiding behind American skirts and come out in the open and face these terrorists eye to eye and NOT to run away from them and take bullets in the back. We dare you cowards !!!!

      November 7, 2011 at 5:51 pm | Reply
      • OMG

        You must be crazy. If you cannot see what is happening in your country and what your country is doing, you are not only blind but also stupid.

        November 11, 2011 at 6:35 pm |
  52. loiseau

    so a ground is being prepared for next war ?

    November 7, 2011 at 2:52 pm | Reply
  53. reality

    When you show the picture like this before starting of article than you definitely have some agenda against Pakistan. Pakistan should not care about the terrorists from West and Terrorists from Afghanistan. They should do what is best for their country.

    November 7, 2011 at 2:34 pm | Reply
    • OMG

      I wish that too. I hope people of Pakistan and for once make their government do something for their country.

      November 11, 2011 at 6:36 pm | Reply

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